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    Roth tank issues 2 (5 Posts)

  • David107 David107 @ 7:48 PM
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    Heard back from Roth

    The recent Roth tank thread got my attention since a few weeks ago the G-115/21 with Riello F3 .50 Delavan nozzle stopped working due to a crimp or blockage in the oil line. Tech found carbon on the head, burner stuck on pre-purge, no ignition. The suction assembly was changed. Nozzle, O-ring and burner 10 micron filter were changed, but there was no evidence of problems with those. (This is a single line feed to burner.) I contacted Roth and got some answers relatively quickly; the tech said he would post on this thread but he hasn’t gotten around to doing that yet. So I’ll synopsize what I heard: They believe that some of the problem involves oil quality (sludge) and additives that contain Napththa— a prime ingredient of cold weather additives, especially in Long Island and New York State. It causes the hose to swell in percentages greater than 35%. He was very clear that their suction assembly does not float (my tech had said he replaced the ‘floating’ suction assembly). Floating could be a sign of malfunction. Roth’s suction assembly has a weight on the end that keeps it at the bottom of the tank. My tech replaced the half-inch tube with a 3/4”; Roth recommends 3/8” fuel feed, the size of their suction assembly for most residences. The use of 3rd party equipment is discouraged and in some cases can void the warranty. Roth sent me a bulletin from 2003 about suction assembly failures. The problem of the suction foot slipping off has been resolved with the addition of a hose clamp; the problem with tubing collapsing under vacuum has been traced to the aforementioned fuel additives, which can also cause seal failures on air shutter pistons due to adverse affects on rubber products. Additives containing napththa should not be used. As an option, suction assembly may be replaced with a ‘hard-piped’ copper suction line and duplex bushing as in standard steel tank installation. In that scenario, the fuel additives do not appear to be a concern. The manual also says that additives added by the distributor in bulk before loading into the delivery truck do not seem to be a problem. I’d like to hear what you experienced oil and burner guys have to say about this; we really can’t afford to have nuisance burner outages like this. I am thinking of asking my service company to hard-pipe a copper suction line for a long-term solution. Any adverse affects of this? I assume we’re talking about the inner-tank line and not the rubber one from tank to burner. Thanks, David
  • Norm Harvey Norm Harvey @ 8:17 PM
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    I've never used the Roth Suction assembly because I heard about the same thing you did. Many people use a double tap bushing and use copper lines, I like to use a 1/2 double tap bushing with a 1/2 Black mallable pipe sticking down into the tank 4 inches from the bottom. I then use a 1/2 male by 3/8 compression fitting at the top and slide the copper tube down through the black pipe. This keeps the copper stable so it doesnt get swayed one way or another during a fill. I make it a duplex double tap bushiung so I am set up for a return line if it is needed also with the black pipe 6 inches higher than the supply pipe. I havea tiny tapemeasure that I can use to slide through the black pipe and measure how much I need to push the copper through as the little hook on the end of the tape can hook the end of the iron pipe. To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
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  • Jim F. Jim F. @ 7:53 PM
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    Roth Tank...

    My distributor gave me a Roth Price Book and in this book they offer either the suction assembly or duplex bushing...I have used nothig but the suction assembly and had zero problems...Yes the end is weighted so it falls to the bottom of the tank.....I did have one thing happen which caused problems...My guys insatlled a tank and put the gauge in the 1st hole then installed the suction assembly then the vent and last the fill.... Well when the oil level dropped the suction assembly and the gauge line wrapped around each other and needless to say when the tank was filled the suction assembly was raised up to the top of the tank and caused the burner to spudder....etc etc... Put the suction assembly in the last hole and the gauge in the 1ast hole and this will never be a problem... This will solve some of those troble calls...etc etc Brian
  • Ray Landry Ray Landry @ 7:22 PM
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    Duplex bushings are the way to go, but only with black iron pipe. Copper will eventually get eaten away by sludge/bacteria which grows in tanks, may take 20 years but it will happen. To Learn More About This Professional, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Professional"
  • N/A @ 3:01 PM

    weakest link

    David, The reason the "flanged" duplex bushing was designed was to correct all the problems with the suction line assembly. IMHO - the last thing I would ever use in any EU tank is a suction line asssembly. The suction line assembly is a the only weak link and the achilles heal to a GREAT oil tank system. The suction line assemblies break down, fall apart, create too much suction(increase exisitrng by at least .7"), have a maximum flow rate as listed, have a lever kids WILL play with and they leak (air and oil). Bottom line, throw out the suction line assembly and put in a flanged duplex bushing, plug one side of the bushing and run a single line (why filter 24000 gallons of oil to deliver 800?). Keep the line at least 1" off the bottom to make up for the tank getting shorter when full. The flanged buplex bushing is available from any good Roth or Schuetz distributor. I could go on, but I'll simply say, a wise man would never use the suction line assembly, even in multiple tank applications. steve
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