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    Slab house/Boiler in kitchen (12 Posts)

  • Bill Julian Bill Julian @ 9:34 AM
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    Slab house/Boiler in kitchen

    Installing a W/W P-WTGO3L oil fired HW boiler the existing boiler has no draft reg so the 7" SP will go directly into chimney. The distance from boiler to chimney is about 6". I might be able to sneak in a strap on 6" BD. The existing boiler has been running fine for years as it is but now that I am installing a new boiler I want to make sure Im good. Any thoughts?

    *If wondering. This is the northeast where we call the house a Campanelli house slab all boilers are usually in the kitchen surrounded by an enclosed metal jacket.
  • icesailor icesailor @ 10:45 AM
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    Draft Control:

    If you're not planning on doing any combustion testing on the finishes installation, that's a good way to go.
    However, just because someone else did it wrong, doesn't mean that someone replacing it the same way, will make it right. It has a UL Listing that calls for a barometric draft control. Make the vent come out of the optional top venting on the boiler and make another hole in the chimney. You can get the boiler closer to the wall and install a draft control. It needs the control for proper efficiency and adjustment.
    If it gets inspected, an inspector isn't doing their job if they pass it.
  • Bill Julian Bill Julian @ 1:28 PM
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    Draft

    I hear ya but the vent must come out from the side back. If I can get a 5 or 6" BD in there you think that will provide suff draft?
  • Weezbo Weezbo @ 4:33 PM
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    Take a peek at this ,

    http://www.heatinghelp.com/forum-thread/86588/G-E-Oil-Boiler

    i live far away from there ,so some "Experiences" i do not have ...
    my thought though was, if i could see what exactly it was , a picture even , then there may be some other this century solution.

    in staying with oil , my thoughts are heat loss and exact dimensions of work area and
    possible piping solutions to and from another location within the dwelling . essentially recapturing the kitchen space for cabinet or new appliance real estate ...

    my buddy just called to see if i was alive ..: ) we seemed to have come up with a solution to a specific problem in winterization , he asked me some things and then i told him about some mining vendor show i went to a couple days ago... i burn lots of daylight with people as i go thru life. ...one off solutions sometimes can lead to changes in the way we do things , it is just a matter of seeing the connectivity of the idea or principle.
    i just hung up the phone while searching for the vendors info and typing this .
    wrrrrr wrrrrr lol..
    This post was edited by an admin on April 13, 2014 4:37 PM.
  • JStar JStar @ 3:10 PM
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    Draft

    Nobody will know if it'll be okay until it's installed and properly tested. For me, trial and error is a bad way of installing systems. That boiler is capable of being top-vented. I would make a new hole in the chimney high enough to handle the right size draft control.
    - Joe Starosielec
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  • LIBob51 LIBob51 @ 4:57 AM
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    Campanelli House?

    Where I come from In the Northeast, Long Island actually, we call the houses you're describing Levitts. They were built after World War II so the boys coming back could return home to affordable housing. I've been told they started at about seven grand brand new, and I wish I was around in those days when America took care of and respected those who took care of America. If this Campanelli house is the same as the Levitts, that Weil McLain Gold you're installing was designed specifically for it. None of the Low York's those houses were built with were installed with draft regulators, but the houses were also built cheaply, quickly, and with a most honorable cause. As far as lost efficiency, the original steel hunk of junk was, and those still in service are inefficient enough, and a draft regulator probably wouldn't have saved much. The effectiveness of the regulator all depends on the strength of your chimney, it's presence will make your new unit louder than it already will be. If you can fit the smoke tee in there, absolutely install the draft regulator. Installs in those houses have their own motto, 'Make everything fit, and get it done quick.' There's a reason this isn't a cooking website, HVAC guys don't belong in the kitchen :)
  • LIBob51 LIBob51 @ 5:01 AM
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    Smoke Hood

    Bill, unless that boiler has been modified very recently, you can swap the rear flu outlet with the top smoke hood.
  • LIBob51 LIBob51 @ 5:03 AM
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    Actually....

    You have one of the hanger's with the washing machine still under it, don't you?
  • heatpro02920 heatpro02920 @ 9:14 AM
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    The last guy ddn't do it

    so why bother, lol... just kidding...

    I have been on more than a couple of these jobs, I have to say there is always a way, I wouldn't run an oil boiler without a draft control, sure it will work, but you can end up with very high stack temps, erratic combustion habits, sooting, ect ect ect..

    I can dig up some pictures when I get home, but there is always an answer, this one seems pretty simple since that boiler can be top vented and its easy to pop a new thimble in the chimney and plug the old one...

    Years back I went to a job that the inspector tagged {they were selling the property} because there was no control, so they wouldn't give a loan on the property without passing the home inspection... So I go out there and its a rear flue jammed in this tiny closet, we had a laundry list of things to fix, combustion air, electric fireomatic, double 5/8 sheet rock, ect this inspector was on the ball.

    So now of course its a tight budget and the guy that installed the boiler was doing it as cheap as he could and not well at that, but the home owner said "It has worked for 7 years" cant argue with that, I guess... So there was literally NO way to get a draft regulator between this thing and the chimney, to be honest if that pipe ever rotted out, you would have to remove the boiler to replace it. So I broke a new hole in the chimney above the boiler and installed a larger regulator there, not perfect by any means, but it did the job, the draft adjusted well and the boiler ran better with it there... The inspector passed it on his next visit...

    Another job I did was similar, existing boiler couldnt fit it between there and when the boiler fired the stack temps were very high as well as their fuel bills... So it was a rear flue jammed into the chimney, I plugged the existing chimney hole, I made a sheet metal box that I fit into the back of the boiler and came up the front of the chimney and behind the boiler, I installed the draft regulator into that box and then a 90 on top of it that went into a new hole in the chimney.

    So picture it the boiler had a 6" termination, I built an 8" wide x 5" deep x 15" tall box, I fit a 6" collar to fit into the breech, made an oval to round termination on the top so I could get to a 6" elbow, then a 6" hole in the front for the regulator, I also made a small side cleanout toward the bottom so it could be vacuumed out.. It has been there a while and no issues, works fine... If it was any closer I would have had to collar into the chimney instead of the elbow but it fit this way and it allowed me to install it with furnace cement, if I collared it I would have had to put it in there blind...

    These 2 jobs were both existing, if I were installing them boilers I would have installed equipment with top outlets, I have done this a ton of times, you have a boiler backed into a chimney, you pick something like the WM golds, they have top flues, top supply, front return, and you plug the rear pressure relief tapping and install it in the front, now you can back that boiler in and install it correctly with no future service nightmares...

    Good luck... Remind me if you want a picture, I know I have one of the box I made probably dont have one of the other job though..
  • Weezbo Weezbo @ 12:31 PM
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    What part of heat shield am i failing to understand?

    whatever it is that i am reading here seems to not be trailing with flying in correct formation.

    Heat shields may not be a requirement , convince me that they are not.

    Safe.
    *~//: )
  • Coany Coany @ 7:57 PM
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    you might pop a 4" d/r into the chimney

    alongside the smoke pipe, I ve done it quite a few times.

    Very familiar withe Campanelli slabs
    " Do what you can, with what you have, where you are" Teddy Roosevelt
    This post was edited by an admin on May 24, 2014 7:58 PM.
  • billtwocase billtwocase @ 8:48 PM
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    chimney

    I would break in higher up, most likely needs a stainless liner anyway. We have them slab houses here too, but they had Lennox warm airs with a Monel water heater. Tough as nails
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