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    Clanging of pipes in hot water return (hydronic) system (21 Posts)

  • Carlton Carlton @ 11:49 PM
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    Reply to Eddie re rattling pipes in hydronic system

    Eddie, Thanks a lot for your response. I have zone valves--3 Honeywell F7 9834 (and actually a 4th for a pipe connecting with the hot water heater). I believe the zones are on the supply piping, but I am really not sure. Maybe this helps: there is a pretty wide diameter steel pipe that runs from the top of my furnace to my expansion (Extrol Model 30) tank and through to a junction of that steel pipe and the three copper pipe lines that go to each floor. I have a Watts regulator Series 1156F and a backflow preventer. I have a single Taco cartridge circulator and have two Taco Hy-Vents--one on top of the furnace, and the other on top of the expansion tank (with that same wide diameter steel pipe in between the Taco and the Extrol). The furnace is pressurized between 12 and 15 PSI. Last maintenance a few months ago said no problems with boiler, draft was -06 -01 smoke 0 stack 550 CO2 12% eff 81.25%. A couple days ago same guys that did my maintenance came in to check the clanging, found by boiler pressure around 30 psi, diagnosed a bad Extrol and replaced the Extrol. The clanging (pipe rattling) has gotten worse and they are not returning my phone call. Needless to say, I have no further trust in them, and I am actively looking to replace them. I hope this is enough information for you to help. Let me know if you need more info. Thanks again.
  • ta finnegan ta finnegan @ 7:12 AM
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    Clanging.

    Some of the Honeywell zone valves are notorious for the banging/clanging that you hear. The Honeywell reps all know about it. They say it should not happen. But it does. To Learn More About This Contractor, Click Here to Visit Their Ad in "Find A Contractor"
  • BillW@honeywell BillW@honeywell @ 12:05 PM
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    Check the following...

    Make sure the water flow is in the same direction as the arrow that is cast into the bottom of any Honeywell zone valve. If the valve is installed backwards, it will bang. It also sounds from your own description that you have long, un-supported or poorly supported piping runs. Adding some extra pipe support can minimize the noise. Banging on startup has nothing to do with the zone valves, it could be trapped air, excessive pump velocity, or expansion/contraction due to heating of the pipes. The holes the pipes pass thru may also be too tight, and the pipes may make a noise as they expand & contract. Check out these items, and I think you'll solve the problem.
  • Boilerpro Boilerpro @ 9:24 AM
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    Two other things I can think of...

    That cause banging. A relief valve popping and the pressure reducing valve filling. Both often tend to chatter until they close again. If the pressure reducing valve is working, you may have a system leak (relief valve?) or it may be leaking by, overfilling the system. By the way, mst relief home relief valves start to open at 27 psi and are full open at 30. If the system was at 30 Psi and the relief valve wasn't opening, you probably need a new relief valve (assuming the gau is reading correctly). Boilerpro
  • Carlton Carlton @ 9:41 AM
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    follow up and recommendation

    Finnegan and BoilerPro, Thanks for your inputs. I try to time the clanging and peek at the pipes feeding into and from the furnace. The pipes are shaking and, I guess, bumping up against walls, flooring, etc. causing the banging and clanging. You belive, Finnegan, that that could be the valves? Do I just have the valves changed? Boilerpro, that is an interesting analysis and insight regarding the PSI. The guy that came out did not even have an analysis. As a matter of fact, he admitted that he did not work of oil furnaces and he was constantly on the phone to the experienced oil guys who were leading him along. Is there an oil furnace/hydronics *EXPERT* anyone can recommend for West Central NJ (Hunterdon County area)?
  • Earthfire Earthfire @ 1:06 PM
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    Expert

    go to find a contractor and check it out .there are some good people on there based right in North Jersey
  • Mike T., Swampeast MO Mike T., Swampeast MO @ 12:32 PM
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    If pipes are very closely fitted (particularly where they pass through holes in the floor and other framing) the expansion and contraction at the beginning and end of the cycle can make some banging as the pipes move in a tight space. If you eliminate everything else remove the b/b covers and look for pipes tight against the side of the holes.
  • john john @ 7:48 PM
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    zone valves

    If you find the pipes banging as the zone valves close( when the thermostats are no longer calling for heat) it very well could be the zone valves. I have run into this with honeywell zone valves in the past. Try running 2 zones of heat at the same time then shut one down if the banging starts at this point it does involve the valves I would recommend supporting any loose piping and I have removed one of the springs in the zone valve which allows it close slower eliminating the problem. It has worked for me in the past John
  • Brian (Tankless) Brian (Tankless) @ 11:12 AM
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    honeywell zone valve

    One zone valve on my 3 zone system will not open when the thermostat calls for heat. If I disconnect the small red wire from the motor and then reconnect it the valve will open. However after it cycles off when temp is reached it will not re-open when thermostat calls for heat unless I again disconnect and reconnect. Can you help? Also, when the motor that opens the valve reaches the point where the valve is fully open should the motor continue to run? Thanks, JMJ11 @ optonline.net
  • BillW@honeywell BillW@honeywell @ 11:53 AM
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    No, it shouldn't...

    It sounds like the wires or the motor have been damaged. The powerhead can be replaced without draining the system, if you are a contractor, order part #40003916-026 from your distributor, if you're a homeowner, use the "Find a Contractor" feature above, or call your local heating contractor. If this is a new valve, the warranty is one year from the date of installation.
  • Paul Paul @ 11:19 AM
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    Banging noise when Honeywell zone control valves open/close

    Thanks for all the suggestions on this topic. I have confirmed all valves have been installed with the water flow arrow in correct direction. I have changed a couple of motors in which the gears seemed to have been stipped as the valve would slam when heat was not longer called for. It seems we have semi-resolved (at least reduced!) the banging in the pipes, by replacing only the ball portion of the valve in those zone valves where we could hear a bang both when the thermostat opened and closed the valve and when we did this manually. (We did this only in those apartments where the tenants have complained of the banging.) While in the apartments to change the ball portion of the valve we also put some insulation around the pipe where it went thru the walls to eliminate the rattle there. I have asked all tenants to let us know about a banging at the zone valve, but other than the select few we have dealt with , no one has come forward with a complaint. (I have NOT personally gone into every apartment and checked to see if there was a banging in that particular apartment. Nor have I insulated every opening thru which the pipes are fed.) In spite of all the above, I still have a few tenants advising/complaining there is noise in the system from time to time. Reportedly the noise still develops even in at least one of the apartments we worked on as described above. Other than physically checking for, and replacing, ?faulty? ball portions of the valve, and insulating every opening the pipes traverse, are there any other suggestions as to why we still have a noisy system? Appreciate any futher info anyone might have. Lastly, is there any other solution to this such as, say as a test, in one apartment completely replacing the heating elements and installing a different sort of valve in that new element? IS there a different sort of valve/setup? Thanks
  • Zman Zman @ 8:25 PM
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    A record

    This may be a record.
    This post is 11 years old.
    Please start a new one.
  • Brian (Tankless) Brian (Tankless) @ 11:31 AM
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    Buying a New Furnace

    My steel furnace is over 20 years old and it was suggested to get a new one before it goes. Cast Iron was suggested as a replacement but I don't know which is better than which. One dealer says Weil McLain is good and another said it has a tendency to leak and Burnham is better. What do you think?I live in Connecticut. Thanks. Jeri [email protected]
  • Brian (Tankless) Brian (Tankless) @ 11:31 AM
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    Buying a New Furnace

    My steel furnace is over 20 years old and it was suggested to get a new one before it goes. Cast Iron was suggested as a replacement but I don't know which is better than which. One dealer says Weil McLain is good and another said it has a tendency to leak and Burnham is better. What do you think?I live in Connecticut. Thanks. Jeri
  • Paul Paul @ 11:35 AM
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    Banging noise when Honeywell zone control valves

    I have a 46 unit apartment building consisting of 2 towers of 3 floors separated by a foyer area. Use slant fin gas boiler, hot water baseboard heating with Honeywell zone control valves; all valves newly installed in 2000. My problem is a banging or clanging in ONLY THE TOP FLOOR, FRONT AND REAR END APARTMENTS ON THE COURTYARD SIDE of the two wings when the thermostat is lowered and the zone control valve closes. I have bled the air from the lines. Why would only the top floor, end apartments experience this banging? What can I do to eliminate this problem? I have read the other messages on this topic, and am wondering if there is something unique about my layout. Thanks in advance for any help provided.
  • BillW@honeywell BillW@honeywell @ 11:51 AM
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    Check out my earlier post (above)

    It sounds like the banging zones may be at the end of the longest runs. Try adding some additional pipe supports, or tighten existing ones. If that fails, remove 1 spring from the valve, that will slow the action down, and should solve your problem.
  • Crazyleb Crazyleb @ 7:55 PM
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    Honeywell zone Value Causing Banging noise when it closes

    Bill,
    you mentioned to remove one of the springs and that will stop the banging noise, i read it somewhere else also, so i removed the spring on the left, and the banging has stopped, you mentioned to remove one of the springs i want to make sure i removed the right one..

    please let me know..

    [email protected]
    This post was edited by an admin on January 21, 2014 8:01 PM.
  • Noel Noel @ 11:53 AM
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    You'll enjoy this story....

    http://www.heatinghelp.com/newsletter.cfm?Id=137
  • jim lockard jim lockard @ 8:42 PM
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    ? noisey pipes to new furnace

    How did we get from a service call to replacing the boiler?
  • Carlton Carlton @ 7:26 PM
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    Clanging of pipes in hot water return (hydronic) system

    I have what I think is a small issue, which was not covered in your FAQ. I am a newbie to oil heat and to hot water return systems. From research, I have determined that I have a Weil-McLain oil fired hydronic system, Beckett burner, Honeywell aquastat, 3 zones of heat. I have copper tube/aluminum fin baseboards. What would be the cause and fix for my hot water pipes banging and clanging when my thermostat clicks off (and less frequently when it clicks on)?
  • EDDIE GRIERSON EDDIE GRIERSON @ 7:37 PM
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    Noise

    You said you have three zones, due you have zone valves, circulators, or a combination? If you have these items were are they located? Supply or return piping? If you have zone valves what type? Also due you have any type of automatic air bleeder? Need more info. to help.
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