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Joined on August 27, 2007

Last Post on August 31, 2014

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Grundfos has a line of cast stainless circs

@ October 17, 2007 8:44 AM in Grunfos Pump

onn the market now. a bit ledd $$s then bronze. Great looking also. hot rod

The EconoBurn folks are anxious

@ October 17, 2007 8:41 AM in Wood Boilers

to help. Contact Mark Odell, VP. He knows his stuff a former Dunkirk boiler star. hot rod

A good plan

@ October 17, 2007 8:38 AM in Isolate air bleed with ball valve

remember some of those air vents have a small tab sticking out of the bottom. You may need a short nipple in the valve. I think Raven makes a deep valve just for this purpose. I like the Jomar brand mini ball valves. The work well for gauges also in the 1/4" size. hot rod

Another \"wire nut\"!

@ October 17, 2007 8:36 AM in Presenting (Alex M.)

enjoy the years together. hot rod

Doing my first panel rad install

@ October 16, 2007 10:48 PM in Panel Rad Aesthetics

I have a tough time selling that "look' here in SW Missouri. I spec them, show them, explain the benefits, still no go. On my current job some feed up from the basement below through the floor. On the upper level I used the wall feed method. It sure is tough protecting the wall penetrations through sheetrock, and base trim install. I'm not looking forward to the connections! I used copper stub out ells from Sioux Chief with the pex barbs. I think the center feed panel rads look the best. It gives the appearence that the tubes are there to support the radiator. Congrats on the RPA awards by the way. hot rod

The loop thru the on-demand

@ October 16, 2007 10:34 PM in pressure loss with spring check valve

will need some serious pumping power. They usually have a fairly restrictive heat exchanger. I'd guess more like a 26-99 to move enough flow to get some of the capacity. i doubt that you will get the full capacity out of the heater with a "pumped flow." These units really aren't a good match for hydronic use. The small HX and low 80% efficiency, when firing, work against the initial "good price :) Most of the manufacturers of those instantanous heaters have a flow chart available. What brand are you considering? Glenn Sossin wrote a good post about this with a piping schematic back about 8/8/07 if you search the archives it may turn up. hot rod

That data should be available

@ October 16, 2007 7:47 PM in pressure loss with spring check valve

from the people that make the check valve. it's called the cv factor. The flow rate in GPM with a one psi drop. Ideally you want the check on the discharge side of the circ. The 15-18 will also have a pump curve and the HX a pressure drop listing at various GPMs. All these pieces of the puzzle will answer your question. Is this a small DHW recirc flowing thru an isolation HX by chance? hot rod hot rod

do you mean

@ October 16, 2007 9:08 AM in Slab Sensor with hardwoods

the bottom side of the hardwood? Between the subfloor and underside of the flooring? hot rod

Nice work!

@ October 16, 2007 9:05 AM in Vito 100 + Taco RMB + Pro press

I like seeing a pan under the indirect tank. And nobody is going to steal that condensate neutralizer :) hot rod

Pin them down on the infiltration

@ October 16, 2007 8:57 AM in radiant floor heat for commercial garage

mainly how often the doors are open, or left open. The only shops I have had complaints about are repair shops that leave the overhead doors open or cracked a bit. Usually they neglect to add an exhaust removal system and the open doors move the fumes out?! If they do have a air removal system you may need a pre-heated make up air system. Just be sure to ask these questions. Better now than later. Add the data to your assumption report on the load calc and have the customer sign that. On large shops I do 5/8 or 3/4 and run 500 or 600 foot loops. makes it easier to get to a one manifold location on a large building. Fifteen inch on center is often do-able also. If it is a 6" slab I would highly recommend the re-bar and tube is elevated on chairs. 6" is way to deep for radiant tube, IMO. Layout any equipment that will need to bolt down, cranes, lifts, etc. PAP tube is easier to locate after an install. FostaPex is an excellent durable tube that provides the heavy wall pex with the al jacket for ease of installation and locating. hot rod

Check with their insurance carrier first

@ October 16, 2007 8:46 AM in Wood Boilers

some homwowner policies flat out refuse to insure solid fuel burners inside. Others add a wood burner rider. And yet still some allow them without question???, Tarm, are some of the gasification wood burners I have used. If they are required to have UL or ASME choices become more limited. Royall has both listings but is not a cleaner burning gasification booler. Also consider a pellet boiler. These are much more operator friendly. Screen prospective wood burning customers carefully. It's a fuel that takes a lot of care and maintenance. And price the job carefully. Remember combustion air, rather expensive all fuel venting may be required. a back up heat source is a good idea. And make sure your liability policy covers wood burning appliance installation :) hot rod

a couple choices

@ October 13, 2007 9:15 AM in small circulator 12 volt

Laing, Marsh, Elsid. has an 809 good for about 5gpm at 4' has a smaller D-5 and a few other choices. Here are the curves for the El sid. I have not found any 12V quite as powerful as the oo7, maybe one of these is enough? hot rod

I'll still sell a Royall

@ October 11, 2007 8:42 AM in Small outdoor boilers

I prefer the gasification units for efficiency, features and emissions. With the small fire box it is sometimes hard to get a full day burn with the small Royall. It is a nicely built unit. Heavy steel, nice door, great track record. Central boiler had a nice pellet/ corn burner boiler at the FarmFest last week. They build their own feeder and control module in the US. It actually uses a small Lp tank for the ignition system. Fire tube boiler design. Central claims they sold 12,500 OWF and boilers last year! hot rod

The old Chiles Power Systems

@ October 10, 2007 10:01 PM in Heat loss calc for 1\" copper heat exchanger

Mike and Dan Chiles founders of Heatway use to build solar powered radiant systems, back in the solar/ Radiant Roll days. They constructed well insulated plywood tanks with EPDM liners in the basements and copper coils. A few years back I had to replace a leaking copper coil in one of these 1980 vintage systems. I wanted to use pex for many reasons, mostly weight and cost. One of the Watts Radiant engineers calced about 3 times as much pex as copper to get 'er done. That seems to jive with what you have calculated. I tried the pex, wasn't impressed. The new owner scraped the whole system, as the solar had been removed years earlier after a hail storm, and had me install a boiler. Great systems for their time. this one had a solar and a pond loop geo desuper heater feeding the tank and radiant with DHW preheat coils. A few hundred pounds of copper when i finally dismantled the system :) hot rod

An AquaTherm

@ October 10, 2007 6:19 PM in Small outdoor boilers

brand can be purchased unsheltered. This allows you to build your own enclosure. AquaTherms are pressurized OWF's. The Royall from is a small size that could fit in a small enclosure. They sell it as a pressurized or non pressurized vessel. I had one at my home for a bit. Fairly small firebox, however. One of the few that has an ASME listing (pressurized version) and UL if your insurance company needs that. hot rod

what about the loads?

@ October 10, 2007 6:00 PM in commercial mod/con

if you have varying loads that Aerco Modulex model modulates from 45,000 to 1 million a 23 to 1 turndown!. Quite a turn down for a large boiler. I saw those boilers used in an apartment building in Italy, under another name. It had quite a few seasons under it's belt and the property manager was impressed with it's performance and fuel use. hot rod

Check out

@ October 10, 2007 5:49 PM in Hardwood floor over concrete

the hardwood that offers. It is solid wood, 3/8" thickness that has a locking detail. Consider this or engineered hardwood over the Roth panels. hot rod

Seems a shame

@ October 10, 2007 5:43 PM in Heat loss calc for 1\" copper heat exchanger

to use all that 1" for a simple HX. If I were to do one again I would use two 1" headers with a bunch of 1/2" soft copper hoops. I would T-drill them into the 1" and silver solder that connection. Here is a coil I built for an 800 gallon concrete in-ground solar tank. I used my Curvo to limit the fittings. I belive I used three 20 foot lengths. i tried to copy the Viessmann horitiz-cell indirect with a low and wide HX. The DHW and radiant coils will be at the top of the tank. I'll be back on this solar job Fri. I inheritied it from a solar guy that bailed. the tank was in the ground and 8 panels in the garage. He also had the slab tubed. This will be my first go at an underground solar tank. We did use 4" of foam inside the tank with an EPDM liner. hot rod

I used a 60 foot coil of 1\"

@ October 10, 2007 2:41 PM in Heat loss calc for 1\" copper heat exchanger

in a 500 gallon concrete tank i had in my shop a few years back. in all honesty the output from that wood boiler isn't a static number. i suspect that amount of coil would move the heat from that boiler just fine. It's fairly easy to solder some fins on the coil. i used some short scraps of copper cut in half with my porta band to build my own fins. Ugly, but it did add square footage at a low cost. hot rod

Will the OWF

@ October 10, 2007 8:18 AM in Outdoor Wood Furnace

heat your domestic hot water also? The simple way is to just control the pump with an additional wall thermostat. i suspect you have some sort of back up heat system? Some installers use a line voltage 120V wall stat to control the circulator. i prefer a pump relay and a 24V wall stat (more choices). You will need some wiring between the building and the OWF. I like to install an extra condiut or two in the trench for options. Power to the OWF and some switch-able wires. I also like to add an inexpensive strap on thermometer to read the boiler temperature from inside the home. saves some cold trips to the stove :) hot rod

A simple

@ October 10, 2007 8:12 AM in Mixing

manual 3 way mix would track along with the OD reset control. For a little more $ you could addd some "smarts' in the form of a 3 way thermostatic. This would better regulate the temperature. I personally agree injection mixing would be over kill. Or run both panels and radiant at 130 :) feed the panels first and the radiant take off from the P/S would probably be close to your need. hot rod


@ October 9, 2007 10:02 PM in Idea

keep trying to fool those instantanous WHers into thinking they are boilers? I haven't had a lot of sucess with the coils connected to a boiler to act as a buffer. I tried a few MZ's with the coil in series as a buffer. Then I tried the tank capacity as a buffer, like the old Trianco indirects. DHW in the coil, boiler in the tank side. That worked much better, but DHW production was lackluster. The Ergomax comes to mind but you need to drive them with 180 temperature to get much DHW performance. Seems silly to run that type of heater to 180 for DHW production then mix down for radiant. Foot on the gas with the brakes as speed control, comes to mind. All things considered the properly sized mod con is hard to beat. the HTP Phoenix does one up the mod concept with on-board buffer :) hot rod