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Joined on December 29, 2008

Last Post on July 8, 2014

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Sensor Location

@ April 1, 2011 7:09 AM in Vitodens LLH Sensor

Strap it on the supply side pipe going out to the system. Better yet install a copper x Female tee and use a 1/2" short honeywell well to slip the sensor in.


@ March 31, 2011 7:14 PM in indirect or not?

I'm not meaing nor intending to be rude but your concerned that an indirect may not be efficient yet you have a 100,00 btu boiler heating 1700 sqft. Your concern should be reducing that load because that boiler is WAY oversized. Do a heat loss and you will see that you only need half or less. That 86% is a not a true statement as to the "Heating Systems" efficiency. It only relates to the burner efficiency. So what that your making 100,000 btu's at 86% efficient. In reality the system is more like 50%. All that extra energy being made that doesn't need to be made is going up the chimmney...This is the main reason why a cold start boiler is more efficient. Reduce chimmney loss.


@ March 31, 2011 7:03 PM in Buffer Tanks

What are the modulation rates of the boilers and will they be cascading? Whose mod/con are you using?

I Struggled

@ March 31, 2011 12:32 PM in which pump

With whether to post it or not. I felt bad, since he has already purchased the boiler and has a contractor helping him with the install, I thought it was the right thing to do. I'd rather see him do it right then end up in trouble which from his post is where he is heading.


@ March 31, 2011 7:03 AM in which pump

I would be using a properly sized pump like the Grundfoss Alpha, Taco VDT or similar pump and zone with valves. I left you a present attached.

Define Cold

@ March 30, 2011 10:12 PM in Can't get warm

You said it feels cold. What is the thermostat reading in the room its in? Is that the room that feels cold or is it another room?

Mack Daddy of all Dual Coil Tanks

@ March 30, 2011 7:13 PM in Indirects?

Since were throwing choices, felt might as well throw the mack daddy out there.

How About

@ March 30, 2011 3:38 PM in Indirects?

This....The 80C

Budget Gone

@ March 30, 2011 10:59 AM in which pump

Think of what it will cost to fix your budget gone job. Spending a few dollars to pay someone with experience in what you are doing to consult for a day will be miles cheapier..

Where did you purchase the TT from? There is an applications manual with the proper piping diagram. Have your contractor friend go to the supply house and get it. You said you need the CH pump..CH pump would be the zone pumps. Indirect would get piped on the primary (boiler) side not the secondary.


You using Outdoor Reset

@ March 30, 2011 8:39 AM in help with control

They can change the thermostat to 90 or 50 and are only going to get the btu output of the rads based on the curve that is set in the boiler. That curve could change all day and all night long. Why overcomplicate. Just use basic programables and set them up. I would not set back more then 3 degrees. If you want to keep them out of them then buy therms that you can lock them out of.

It's Nice

@ March 30, 2011 7:29 AM in ecobee

It's nice and easy. Haven't used them on a multiple job though...I use the Wirsbo Climate Newtork which also gives internet access. I think the Ecobee is an easy sell. Consumers love to play with their phones and I-Pads....The only isse I see with vacation homes is that your done if the power goes out. Would be nice to be able to ping a satellite feed as back-up instead of relying on a modem at all times..

Everyone has cell service. If there was a port in the interface to plug in an air card that could be used as back-up it would be a home run..

Take a Look

@ March 29, 2011 9:39 PM in Replacing Gas Boiler Questions

At the Burnham ES2. I'd question the heat loss of the basement. If 4 ft of it is under ground no way it's loss can be at the 1st floors loss. Boiler should be sized for the heat loss. You don't deduct the efficiency of the boiler gross to match the heat loss. If you want to be conservative use the DOE rating if the boiler is in a conditioned space not the net..

Yes He Will

@ March 29, 2011 9:31 PM in Curious as to what

The boiler will just sit there and look at him and do nothing with no error codes. If you don't make the flow switch it does nothing but look at you and say..Hey, read the directions I need some foreplay...

Sold a Few

@ March 29, 2011 8:06 PM in Combination heating and domestic water boilers?

Sold a few. Mostly for those jobs where the builder wanted cheap but stilled play on the high eff angle to put a few bucks in his pocket while beating up the installer. I do have to say haven't had any problems on the dozen or so I sold. Ask me in another couple years though.

I think the target is going to be exactly what this contractor is doing. Condo, Apartment type applications where they want the cheapiest they can get while riding the efficiency card to a few extra bucks. The installers are at the mercy of bid and spec generally on these type of projects. I don't see these as being promoted to the residential market but you never know.

I agree with you, looks like a kickspace heater on steriods..

I Think

@ March 29, 2011 2:01 PM in Combination heating and domestic water boilers?

It's there anwser to fighting off the tankless mfgs. It is 96%, rated as boiler but like everything, you get what you pay for...


@ March 29, 2011 1:45 PM in Combination heating and domestic water boilers?

May want to take a look at the attached. While, this is not made by them the mfg across the pond sold a few hundred thousand of them last year from what I was told. Have seen it live, pretty quite and easy to service.

It's A Condesing Boiler

@ March 29, 2011 12:30 PM in help with control

It's a condensing boiler with outdoor reset. No need for fancy thermostats. Just use plain jane programables wire to a circulator zone control which in turn is wired back to the boiler and let it fly. If the tenant does deep setback, they will only do it once. Why?  Because you will get a phone call that the heat isn't working properly. It may take hours for the rooms to get back up from a deep setback.

If a proper heat loss was done and heating curve they wouldn't have a need to touch it.

Pump Size

@ March 29, 2011 12:22 PM in which pump

The central heating pump should be sized to be able to move gpm requirement of the btu's that need to be delivered while overcoming the head loss of that particular system or zone. In the case of a multiple zone that would be the zone that has the highest head. If the pump can overcome the highest head, it can overcome all.

I'm assuming you pri/sec piped the boiler.

Heat Loss

@ March 29, 2011 12:12 PM in Replacing Gas Boiler Questions

Could you please provide the heat loss that was calculated to come up with the replacement boiler size. Please, if possible, break it down to each zone the air handlers are providing heat to.What size are the air handlers?

Without this information, atleast for me, does not provide enough information to give you with a proper anwser. Condensing technology is not new to the industry. No matter which type of system you choose, whether cast iron or high efficiency, will only operate and be as reliable as the installation. As a consumer you should be more concerned with the installer then the piece of equipment.

A typical home of your size in LI that is reasonably insulated with updated windows would only have a heat loss of 75,000 to 96,000. I would say the choices provided to you are for an oversized boiler. Oversized equipment leads to more maintenane, service and reduces the life span of the equipment. These among other reasons are why a heat loss of the home is necessary.  

Usually not the MO

@ March 29, 2011 7:24 AM in Curious as to what

Viessmann is very conservative and I'm sure would frown upon those statements being made. I've never heard nor have spoken to anyone at Viessmann that has stated you do not have to do a combustion test at start-up.

Yes It's OverKill

@ March 28, 2011 8:27 PM in Need Help figuring out gallons needed for water heater

I just quoted a job. 36 Apartments. Existing 2 165,000 80 gallon Gas Water Heaters. Solution. Vitodens 200 WB2B105 with ONE Vitocell B-300 Dual Coil Tank.

Did a hotel that the called for 1.5mil boilers and 4 120 Gal indirects. Was able to use 2 Vitocell B-300 Dual Coil tanks instead of 4 indirects.
Somone never did there research and just put in what an engineer called for. What do you have for boilers?


@ March 28, 2011 7:57 PM in Curious as to what

You have to be careful when setting this boiler up. You must run the boiler for a minimum of 5-10 minutes before sticking your probe in the provided test ports. At both low and high fire. There is a procedure for combustion testing so whomever is passing that info on is not giving 100 percent correct information. After the inital setup though it will monitor and test itself on every fire.

The manual does say to do a combustion test on startup, see page 26 of the attached in my post above.The boiler will give you a high CO right at fire. It uses this high CO to calibrate itself. I've received many a phone call because of high readings due to guys sticking the probe in the test port and then turning the boiler on. The manual isn't clear on running the boiler prior to test.
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