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Joined on October 13, 2004

Last Post on September 1, 2014

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@ September 1, 2014 8:25 PM in two different metals

Silver brazed salt water pipe was a theory, but may not have been the cause. especially after a short period of service.


@ September 1, 2014 8:21 PM in two different metals


@ September 1, 2014 5:41 PM in two different metals

Your not mistaken in what 3 things need to take place for Galvanic corrosion to happen. As in mentioned in my last post there are other variables that can make it more aggressive.

As the hydronisist knows O2 is an enemy anyways even in a perfect world.

O2 can be at varying levels in water. Obviously as low as you can go before its no longer water is the ultimate goal Ice.

There are many Factors

@ September 1, 2014 1:15 PM in two different metals

O2,PH, Dirt, and many other things play arole in how aggressive the corrosion can be.

Hydronic safe

@ September 1, 2014 9:22 AM in two different metals

Yeah Ice mines been there for 62 years black pipe to copper with no issues.hard to get away from some kind of dissimilar piping/component connection. Unless it's an all iron hot water radiator, or steam system.

Not to say this topic is not important to be aware of. There is always a chance of stray current in the water pipes through improper bonding, and or grounding of electrical systems which would accelerate corrosion.

Radiant ceiling option

@ September 1, 2014 8:50 AM in Floor Board Radiant Converting To Underfloor?

Is a good one. Wondering how far your going with the remodel?

Radiant ceilings don't care what kind of floor covering you use.

It uses lower water temps than under floor with plates. Crucial if you step up to a high efficiency boiler in the future.

Depending on how for you go with the remodel could do a sandwich radiant floor. Gets the tubing closer to the work if you can Handle some floor elevation change.

Floor Board Radiant??

@ August 30, 2014 8:51 AM in Floor Board Radiant Converting To Underfloor?

Are you refering to baseboard hot water heat?


@ August 28, 2014 6:47 AM in Help designing constant circulation with CI radiatiors and low mass boiler

The I valve R has reset capability you have that. The S series has setpoint capability. So S Series for boiler protection it has a boiler return sensor, and supply sensor.

Delta T circ would do the job on the emitter side also probably better even than delta P. Set the delta for 20* and the circ will change speed to maintain set delta as trvs close, and higher flow rates start to happen. The Bumble bees curve may not meet the system flow rates, and head though.

TRVs Danfoss, Caleffi make nice ones.

Think about boiler cycling, and buffer tank.

NY Plumber

@ August 26, 2014 6:30 AM in Scorched Air vs Hydrocoil

I think your on the right train of thought. If both HX's are the same temp the air flow should have same RH.

Now the variables of the claims are. In the discussion you had is The FA guy taking this into account, and if so were the happy Hydro air people seeing the same coil temps? Same RH in the house itself? New construction with lotsa moisture to purge out of materials yet?

Apples to apples I just cant see how hydro air vs FA could be different unless coil temp was lower, or it had a leak ;0

I See

@ August 25, 2014 6:17 PM in Help designing constant circulation with CI radiatiors and low mass boiler

A Taco I Valve with outdoor reset, and boiler protection. Yes you have to keep return temps to boiler above 130.
You say you have reset capability on the boiler , but not whether you have the components for ODR. Primary secondary Piping, or Hydraulic seperator. Delta P circulator on radiation side of an eco vario circ, or bumble Bee variety for the TRV's after seeing what system head is if those circs will work. They should.

If you are over radiated thats great for modulating water temps. To bad its not a Modulating boiler, but I take it oil is only available fuel source.

Another option TRV with bypass

@ August 24, 2014 8:59 AM in Hot water baseboard heater too big for room

Is a good one johnny.

Curious on the system before tearing fins off baseboard, or doing anything.

Complex problem

@ August 23, 2014 11:11 PM in Hot water baseboard heater too big for room

If I'm reading your post correctly that room has its own thermostat? Does that thermostat only control that room?

How is the rest of the house ? Cold rooms hot rooms?

Wondering how the baseboards are piped. That room may be the first baseboard in a loop.

Another option is lowering supply temp to the baseboard say from 180 to 160. All though this could have under heating consequences in the other baseboard in the house.

Not the boiler

@ August 21, 2014 11:38 AM in Best Cast Iron Boiler?

Usually it's the installer. That's what you need to look for. A good installer has a selection of boilers he uses that he can readily get parts for in case there is a problem.

Most boilers are created equal. It's the installation that makes all the difference as to the efficiency, and longevity of the boiler.

Your exactly right

@ August 20, 2014 10:04 PM in Hydronic Baseboard Altitude Derate?

Not enough to worry about at 5000'. If your paranoid raise AWT to 170, or add more base board No?


@ August 20, 2014 7:58 PM in Hydronic Baseboard Altitude Derate?

Thermal Mass

@ August 17, 2014 3:40 PM in System's Architect

The control strategy could be tricky in that getting the btus when you need them, and where you need them, and keeping them at bay when you do not. the more high mass surfaces involved the higher the level of control needed.

I see seasonal transitions as hurdles for short periods of time. Fly wheel effect depends on how aggressive these seasonal changes happen.

I'm intrigued by this project, but Im wondering about actual real life marketing potential of such a dwelling once dialed into a production aspect. The more complex the more they run away. Lots of widgets to go bad, and replace over time.

Heck Mod/Con boilers were all the craze when they hit the front. Now we have certain people at all levels wondering about ROI for such a high maintenance complex piece of equipment as compared to a CI boiler.

Will the time come when they are the Norm yes, and its only when people dont have a choice in the matter is when these energy conservation products/structures become common place in society sadly it usually happens when its to late.

Just look at the missed opportunity from the last housing bubble. If some hard line standards for conservation were in place think of the potential that could have been.

Please dont take offense to my post Rod I see good potential with your project. But there is the devils advocate in me that sees how far the sucess will go in the market place.


@ August 17, 2014 10:55 AM in System's Architect

Is the way to go like Rich stated. More responsive than concrete floors, plus radiant ceilings in cooling mode have a little more output than radiant floors. Use RFH in some select areas baths. Tight tube spacing a must.

Use of less conductive floor coverings with radiant ceilings will give a neutral effect to the bare feet.

Thermostat for other reasons

@ August 4, 2014 10:26 PM in Oversizing hot water baseboard for efficiency?

In Ice's example would be a thermostat serving as a High limit control.

My solution

@ August 4, 2014 9:49 PM in Smart solution of outdoor shower

30Gal electric tank water heater, drained for the winter. Skip the PV panels to power the WH.

Just to give you an idea

@ August 4, 2014 9:01 PM in Pool heater

My Hayward pool heater is 150000 btu. It raises the pool temp 1/2* per hour for 15000 gal pool. Which is not bad if you plan ahead, or maintain a desired temp constantly.

So ice is pretty close in his calculations.

Those figures are by the book, and dead on real world.

One biggie will they cover the pool when not in use? Evaporation is the heatloss killer in the pool world.

And yeah keep the pool water out of the boiler eh. Like Henry said titanium HX.

Good read

@ August 4, 2014 8:51 PM in flow on system?

Gravity hot water systems have very low head.

Why not use TRVs instead of zone valves? A much better option then use a delta p, or t circ ECM flavor like the bee.

Regarding TRV control

@ August 4, 2014 12:18 AM in Micro-load Dilemma: Add Storage or Nuclear Option

It would be best to use constant circulation. TRVs control space temp ODR controls boiler/ water temp. Use a ecm circulator to curve power consumption.
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