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JStar

JStar

Joined on February 27, 2010

Last Post on July 29, 2014

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Another quick chart.

@ March 19, 2010 6:06 AM in expansion tanks

Extrol has a quick reference chart. I'm guessing it makes a lot of assumptions as to pipe lengths and total system size, but it will get you close if you lose your calculator. 

Did you...

@ March 17, 2010 6:04 AM in Can't get the 4th zone to heat. What System is this?

...size the tank to the system? What is the boiler btuh output? And what make/model boiler?

And...

@ March 16, 2010 5:31 AM in When is wrong, not really wrong?

...is that a 1 inch equalizer? That would be the second one I've seen this week.

I bet if you tried to "fix" this piping, you'd have to come back at least once to change something that was worse than before.

P.S. It's not a bullheaded tee, but the header is piped wrong. The take-offs should be after the leftmost supply riser from the boiler.

hmm

@ March 16, 2010 5:25 AM in matching steam supply to load & room temp

"Percolate" doesn't sound very efficient in a steam system.

Yeah.

@ March 16, 2010 5:23 AM in What do you think?

But who likes to crawl around bleeding radiators? Buy a good air separator, save on medical bills for bad back and knees.

A couple things.

@ March 16, 2010 5:18 AM in Can't get the 4th zone to heat. What System is this?

What pressure is your boiler running at? It should be at least 24 psi to get water up to the fourth floor.

How are the zones piped to the boiler? Are all of the pumps in the boiler room? Can you find a Delta-P (foot of head) and GPM rating for the hot water coil?

I'm thinking that the fourth zone pump is trying to overcome too much resistance in the coil and four stories worth of piping. If you find the numbers for the head on the coil, and the equivalent length of pipe, compare that to the pump curve for whatever pump you have. You may need to create a secondary loop with a separate pump just for the fourth zone. That would mean, disconnecting the coil, have the existing pump just take care of the vertical piping, and tee a loop near the air handler with a separate (smaller) pump just for the resistance in the coil.

...

@ March 15, 2010 6:41 PM in new boiler

Do you have a picture handy. My copy of The Lost Art is in my work van.

Geez.

@ March 15, 2010 6:38 PM in hydrotherm sg-200? Hammer

Get those risers to a main.

Vent tappings.

@ March 15, 2010 5:45 AM in Please help!

The vents are supposed to be about 1/2 way up the radiator.

If you move the Hartford loop connection down, you still might have a problem with your A Dimension, so if you can't raise the dry return, start lowering the cut in pressure as low as it will go and still let the boiler come back on. If you set it too low, the boiler may never fire back up.

Suggestion.

@ March 14, 2010 8:31 AM in New to steam - need help with start up

Very, very highly recommend that you also purchase the Vent Capacity Chart from this website. It will let you know exactly what the air in your system is doing, and how to make the right changes.

Have you checked...

@ March 14, 2010 8:22 AM in noisy vents

...that the radiators are pitched towards the valve, and that the valves are completely open?

...

@ March 13, 2010 8:51 PM in radiant drying rack?

Have you looked at the designs for some simple towel warmers? Then you could pipe it in with a zone valve and wall switch or aquastat to turn it on.

Some inspiration.

@ March 13, 2010 8:29 PM in radiant drying rack?

I might have seen it in the EDR book or somewhere else, but a similar concept has been done for kitchen cabinets to keep food warm. I forget exactly what it was called.

Pressure.

@ March 13, 2010 7:19 PM in relief valve

Try adjusting your pressure back down to about 6 psi. If the pump is giving you a 10 delta P, you're coming pretty close to the relief pressure. It sounds like water is being fed in when the pump runs. Since the highest loop is less than 5 feet above the boiler, you won't need a lot of fill pressure.

Height.

@ March 13, 2010 11:56 AM in relief valve

What's the height of the highest system pipe in the house? Also, how much pipe is between the supply pipe and expansion tank, and what size?

I dig it.

@ March 13, 2010 11:50 AM in What do you think?

Every part should come with a flanged option.

Baseboard.

@ March 13, 2010 11:48 AM in steam baseboard?

Just be aware of proper pitch Using only 4 feet of baseboard, means one side will start 2" high. With 15" clearance, you shouldn't have a problem.

I've never seen that.

@ March 13, 2010 7:24 AM in New to steam - need help with start up

So, the system is one pipe but the radiator is two pipe. Initially, that sounds like a good way to separate steam and condensate in the radiator. 

Water feed.

@ March 13, 2010 7:17 AM in relief valve

Where is the water feed piped to in relation to the pump and expansion tank?

First.

@ March 13, 2010 7:13 AM in hydrotherm sg-200? Hammer

I would first repipe the entire near boiler. That will give you the best chance of solving the water hammer. Lower the water line back to normal and set your pressure to cut out at 2.

Insulated pipes will stop steam from condensing, but it won't tell water that's already there to go back. Sounds like the water is coming straight from the boiler.

When you say "half of the risers are piped directly down into header." Do you mean the risers to the radiators coming off the main?

There's water hammer near the end of the heating cycle

@ March 13, 2010 7:06 AM in Please help!

The Hartford Loop isn't piped properly.
Make sure the connection between the return and the
equalizer is far enough below the boiler's water line. If steam can
work it's way down the equalizer and into the wet return it will
hammer, and usually at the end of the cycle.

See if there's a long nipple on the Hartford Loop. Long nipples create
water hammer as the condensate returns. Replace the long nipple with
either a close nipple or a wye fitting.

-from A Pocketful of Steam Problems.

Water line.

@ March 13, 2010 7:03 AM in New to steam - need help with start up

The water line will always bounce a little. The calmer the better, but you can't expect 212+ degree water to sit still. As long as it doesn't move up and down the whole length of the sight glass, you'll generally be okay. In your case, the pair of bullheaded tees could be causing a little back pressure and rocking the water line a bit. 
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