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Rich

Rich

Joined on May 27, 2011

Last Post on September 1, 2014

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Besides

@ August 4, 2014 11:43 AM in Navien CH240 drawing intake air from basement?

the possibility that if the house is tight where will the unit gets it's makeup air from then after inside air is exhausted ?  Not a good install in my opinion .

Math

@ August 4, 2014 11:38 AM in TriangleTube Install

you have to determine the highest head loss zone , all segments must be added . That is the head loss you must overcome and as for GPM it would be the total required flow when all rads are calling

Smallest load

@ August 4, 2014 10:19 AM in TriangleTube Install

what do you expect it to be ?  P & S may be necessary but can be done in a better fashion for your particular application . Hydraulic separation for what you are doing would be more beneficial with a small buffer tank . Constant circulation on the emitter side and a small circ on the boiler side . This will provide the situation where your TT can really perform to it's capabilities while preventing short cycles .
Where in Maine are you located ?

Heat loss

@ August 4, 2014 7:00 AM in choosing (1) Integrated Boiler Hydro-Air and baseboard, vs (2) Separate Furnace and Boiler

Since you have been reading for awhile you should know about the importance of heat loss calculations before designing / installing any system .  Has any of the contractors performed one yet ? If not you should move onto the next guys in line or seek out one that will do this . 
 Now the next concern .  Is the home insulated , what kind of windows are there ? Be very careful of who does the heat loss or you may still end up with an oversized unit . Tell whomever quotes this your priorities also such as hot water usage for your family and how you use the heat .
Pointer :  If you hear anything remotely like " Well I have been doing this for so long I just know " , or South of the Mass Pike gets 25 BTU per ft and North gets 35 get rid of that guy also and move on or buy a house South of the Pike .
Where in Mass are you ?  
  The part of the system supplying the air handlers if in the attic should have a heat exchanger and at least a 30% glycol fluid to avoid freezing as Ice has stated .

Emerson Swan

@ August 3, 2014 1:48 PM in Emerson swan

They did in fact dump AO Smith recently . They also became the rep for HTP and HTP got rid of Gooding as their rep .  Sounds like both companies did a lot of thinking about where the future will bring them .

Dining Room

@ July 28, 2014 6:43 AM in Help with poor install

If I am looking at this correctly there is 20 feet of radiation in the dining room which requires 11.5 . This on top of the fact that it is on the hottest part of the series loop may well be the problem .  The thermostat may be satisfying before enough heat can be supplied to the other rooms . I would eliminate that 4 footer on the interior wall to start with and employ a Delta T circ for the first floor zone , this will have the zone run long enough to satisfy other rooms and keep the temps to all baseboards closer to an average .  A good starting point for the money it will cost . 

Thermostat

@ July 27, 2014 11:45 PM in Help with poor install

where is it located Paul ?  What are your plans for the basement ?

Fine Line 30

@ July 27, 2014 8:05 PM in Help with poor install

Could you please tell us in what room your series loop begins and ends ?   This could be very interesting . I have seen many systems sized perfect by the numbers but overlooking one important thing .  Every piece of heat removes energy and every piece after that is receiving a lower temp fluid which obviously effects its output . Also the imaginary 15% HEF .    And you said upstairs is good , correct ?

No ducts

@ July 27, 2014 7:52 PM in Builing an addition

You have hot water , keep hot water . Add panel rads w / trvson your new second floor , do a proper heat loss , downsize the boiler to something appropriate . Make the panel rads homeruns to a manifold with some ECM circ , put a thermostat in a 2nd floor room and set it 2 degrees above the setting on that TRV .  DO NOT PUT DUCTS . Any connection between unheated and heated areas is BAD .  Don't get sucked into the bringing the attic into the thermal envelope tarp just so you can install garbage . Leave the thermal boundary at the ceiling and let the attic breathe . Use a ductless minisplit with as few or as many evaporators that you deem necessary , they do come in other than ugly wall mounted beasts .   

Something for nothing Syndrome

@ July 26, 2014 6:11 PM in Want to move from oil to gas boiler. Best way forward?

They all are enthused with the idea that they are gonna get what we offered them in our bid for much less .   Space is the other thing , you mean I can have an extra 25 sq ft for all my s$%t that I don't need .  And then there's the Walmart theory , we can make it somewhere else cheaper .  Go ahead everyone support S Korea all the while you bitch about the economy here . 

Bad & No Math

@ July 26, 2014 6:02 PM in Help with poor install

lots of all of it happened here I would presume .  Could you attach pictures of the boiler and near piping and also how the baseboard was run ?
  Do some rooms have multiple pieces of heat ?  How did you arrive at the heat loss number for the first floor ? Is there LOTS of GLASS on the first floor ?  Remember , the BEST WINDOW is a TERRIBLE WALL .

Absolutely

@ July 24, 2014 9:35 AM in Want to move from oil to gas boiler. Best way forward?

correct Carl . I apologize to any who I may have offended with actual theory which makes sense .
 Funny thing happened last June 2013.  I was in Cranston and there were a bunch of guys there that work for Navien . Some were from the West coast and some from Cherry Hill , All tech support guys though . What was amazing is the fact that while overhearing their conversations and listening to their questions it occurred to me and many others that these guys knew nothing about hydronics , they only had manufacturer product specific training and knew NO SCIENCE .  Really was illuminating to me . Just sayin

Fairness

@ July 24, 2014 8:51 AM in Want to move from oil to gas boiler. Best way forward?

Chris and Snowmelt ,
   Chris , in all fairness the Navien would be able to provide 100k for space heating at a 40* Delta T . Lest we never forget the Universal Hydronics Formula . 
George the Navien will never be able to provide 199K for space heat . Again ,Lest we never forget the Universal Hydronics Formula .

Holowinko

@ July 24, 2014 8:43 AM in Want to move from oil to gas boiler. Best way forward?

Are you empl;oyed by Navien or did they certify you to install their product ?

Combis

@ July 24, 2014 8:34 AM in Want to move from oil to gas boiler. Best way forward?

The only combis you hear about are tankless . Why is that ?  Because the guys installing them don't know or only care about the wrong thing , first cost . After they install them and add P&S piping and do it wrong and come back to your house 5 times and your still unhappy then you go to the wall for a 300 post discussion you still have garbage .  Here , this is made right here and serves your purpose better . With a 1 bath house it is plenty and your efficiencies will be just fine with the right control strategy . This is a combi , just the right kind .  http://www.htproducts.com/versaflame.html
  Keep your money here at home and have it done right .  All you need extra with this is a nice Taco I series outdoor reset valve . Tankless looks sexy but when you get to the party she's really just an ugly fat chick .

Hubbard Cobb

@ July 24, 2014 8:20 AM in What did it cost in 1960?

Your dream house for under 3500 dollars (1950) .   Yes boys , it had radiant heat

NRT

@ July 24, 2014 8:13 AM in Tubing size, spacing, flow rate for a joist install

Rob Brown is at Rockport Mechanical in Lewiston Me .  Maybe you could contact him for assistance

Expansion Tanks

@ July 22, 2014 7:29 AM in bladder tank total volume - who cares?

May be the only part of our systems where bigger is better won't hurt . Remember to charge that tank before filling the system .

Kegs

@ July 22, 2014 7:25 AM in Inexpensive boiler buffer tank

are too small for this

Delta T

@ July 17, 2014 9:03 PM in Complete new system on small house

Also take into account that CI Rads play very well with 30 - 40* Delta T so with ODR you can be in the condensing condition for much of the year

Thermal Battery Systems

@ July 16, 2014 11:46 AM in GEO COOLING

Contact James Schenck . He is who you wanna speak to . Listen to what he has to tell you and be glad you did .

https://www.linkedin.com/groups?home=&gid=4967184&trk=my_groups-tile-grp

Default in my mind

@ July 15, 2014 1:48 PM in Second guessing

when I am out in a remote site I always order 3 lineal feet for every 2 square , 0" 12" 24" , 3 lineal feet for 2 sq . We save lots of trips this way and always have stuff in shop for those small jobs .
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