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Joined on November 26, 2011

Last Post on April 24, 2014

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Radiant gas

@ April 1, 2014 10:31 AM in Hydronic radiant heating subtleties

Yes, those are in the right family.  There are lots of options, in all sizes

Occupancy sensors

@ April 1, 2014 10:20 AM in Indirect or Combo Boiler with Recirc DHT?

are just one way to skin the cat.  You can add a single pole switch downstream of the occupancy sensor if needed.  Four baths and a kitchen is a different animal.  Home run 3/8" manifold systems are one answer, and you can mix those with recirc as long as you follow the rules (no recirc through the manifold, at least with the Manabloc.)

24 x 7 recirc works if you really minimize the flow with something like a B&G ecocirc e3 Vario.  If you install a "standard" recirc pump (003B or similar, or even worse, one of those 006B's they have on the shelf at the local supply house) you will consume much more of both electricity and gas.

Read up

@ April 1, 2014 10:07 AM in How To Make Current System More Efficient before you start buying parts.


@ April 1, 2014 10:02 AM in Rehau

is compatible with all PEX connector systems.

PEX-B is not compatible with expansion systems (F1960, F2080)

For reference:

  1. ASTM F876 Standard Specification for Crosslinked Polyethylene (PEX) Tubing
  2. ASTM F877 Standard Specification for Crosslinked Polyethylene (PEX) Plastic
    Hot- and Cold-Water Distribution Systems
  3. ASTM F1281 Standard Specification for Crosslinked Polyethylene/Aluminum/Crosslinked
    Polyethylene (PEX-AL-PEX) Pressure Pipe
  4. ASTM F1807 Standard Specification for Metal Insert Fittings Utilizing a Copper Crimp Ring
    for SDR9 Cross-linked Polyethylene (PEX) Tubing
  5. ASTM F1960 Standard Specification for Cold Expansion Fittings with PEX Reinforcing
    Rings for Use with Cross-linked Polyethylene (PEX) Tubing
  6. ASTM F2023 Standard Test Method for Evaluating the Oxidative Resistance of
    Cross-linked Polyethylene (PEX) Tubing and Systems to Hot Chlorinated Water.
  7. ASTM F2080 Standard Specification for Cold-Expansion Fittings with Metal Compression-Sleeves
    for Cross-linked Polyethylene (PEX) Pipe
  8. ASTM F2098 Standard Specification for Stainless Steel Clamps for Securing
    SDR9 Cross-linked Polyethylene (PEX) Tubing to Metal Insert Fitting

Waiting for water

@ March 31, 2014 6:59 PM in Indirect or Combo Boiler with Recirc DHT?

is not that long.  If you install an occupancy sensor for the bathroom light, you can wire the recirc pump to that and put a Taco 563-2 aquastat in series (which will stop the pump once the water arrives.)

VRV is big

@ March 31, 2014 5:53 PM in Hydronic radiant heating subtleties

commercial stuff, and I don't believe they have a radiant indoor unit for it.  I think the smallest outdoor unit is 6 tons.

For that patio, radiant would be by far the best option.  If you did the ceiling, you'd need to be absolutely certain the zone would never freeze, and I'd suggest something like a mechanical wall switch timer wired to the zone valve so it couldn't get left on.  Or you could just install a natural gas radiant garage-type heater out there.

PEX is fine

@ March 31, 2014 10:20 AM in Navien 240 combi installed - I have concerns

As long as it's sized and installed properly.  Underground, it's far better -- especially in acidic soil.  Watch out for the fittings and rings in that case.  ProPEX EP fittings and rings have higher flow and are immune to corrosion and dezincification.  You'll need PEX-A pipe to use them.

1/2" mains

@ March 31, 2014 10:14 AM in Navien 240 combi installed - I have concerns

that I have seen were installed before WWII.  Run hard water through them for 60+ years and you get something more like a 3/8" line -- or worse.

Forum eats postings

@ March 31, 2014 8:45 AM in Coming From the"High"Country CO...(Altitude not Attitude:-)

With the pointy brackets in them.  Anything to the right of a left-pointy will evaporate.  Took me about five posts one night to figure out what was happening.  Squiggly brackets and square brackets don't seem to have this issue.

Simultaneous heat and cool

@ March 31, 2014 8:40 AM in Hydronic radiant heating subtleties

would require two terminal heat pumps -- something the Daikin VRV line does, but not the Altherma.

We do not discuss price here, but the tax credits should make the solar kit roughly zero additional cost.

SImple route

@ March 30, 2014 11:46 AM in mega steam mst396 or mst 513

370 feet of EDR.  MST396 has 396 sq feet.  Done.

Dawn Solar

@ March 30, 2014 10:39 AM in Radiant Roof snow melt ??

Used a design just like this.  Not sure if they are still out there selling "dealerships."

As long as your emitter system is low temp, it should work pretty well most of the year.  Would also work well for black body radiation at night.

Can't beat the lack of visual impact.

Retrofit floor heat

@ March 29, 2014 4:59 PM in in floor heat with a cast iron boiler?

pretty much requires heat transfer plates and insulation underneath the tubing.  Omitting either is just plain foolish.

Heating capacity will depend on the thickness of the T&G and (to a lesser extent) the species of wood.  As long as the bottom surface is flat, you will get decent performance out of extruded aluminum C-plates (sometimes called Omega plates.)  If your joists are on 16" centers, plan on two runs per joist bay.  Make sure you have enough capacity (maximum floor surface temp 85ºF) before you leap.

Please start a new thread with this title

@ March 29, 2014 4:31 PM in Rinnai tankless woes

and you will get more eyeballs on it.



@ March 28, 2014 11:54 PM in Pipe Freezing

Somehow I read frozen pipes needing repair.  Press will minimize downtime for sure, whatever the bypass plan.

DHW, gotcha

@ March 28, 2014 10:34 PM in Pipe Freezing

I'd verify required flow rates first, then (at those sizes) install cam & groove to NPT adapters wherever needed and bypass with hoses.  That should buy you enough time to let things thaw out and see what actually needs replacing.

More info

@ March 28, 2014 9:38 PM in Pipe Freezing

hydronic heat or DHW system?  Alternate/backup heat source options?  Sometimes it's better to bypass the bad bits with PEX or hoses and then work your way out of the mess.

Video, please

@ March 28, 2014 8:50 PM in Coming From the"High"Country CO...(Altitude not Attitude:-)

visions of Dave Barry

Just like a dry floor system

@ March 28, 2014 8:15 PM in Radiant Roof snow melt ??

only upside down.  Retrofit aluminum C-plates to the sheathing from below, then install tubing and insulate.

Energy costs

@ March 28, 2014 11:22 AM in Radiant Roof snow melt ??

Your NG might actually be $0.844 per therm?  If so, the difference is more like $31.08 per million BTU on electric versus $10.55 for 80% NG or $8.88 for a 95% mod/con. is your friend.  Don't forget to net out the fuel costs from the bottom of the bill -- those surcharges and taxes can easily add 15-20% for smaller users.


@ March 28, 2014 10:30 AM in Ideas for 1860's unheated farmhouse

I'd probably be looking at TRVs on those panel rads.

TT Prestige Solo and plate exchanger

@ March 27, 2014 10:20 AM in Mod con and plate exchanger

Not sure if this works on the TriMax control or not, but it did on the MCBA:  If you install a 3-way that has a 120V motor, you can tell the control it's installed in an Excellence and it will manage your external diverter valve automagically.
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