Joined on January 19, 2012
Last Post on March 7, 2014
@ January 31, 2014 2:04 PM in tekmar 363 and UNOCCIn theory doing the setback using water temp should work. You calculate the water temp needed to match the heat loss at a given indoor temp and you are good to go.
Here is my problem with it.
The boiler will be calling and hot anytime the outdoor temp is below the WWSD setpoint. Anytime the boiler is hot, you are wasting some heat and electricity.
The boiler and baseboard loop will have to remain above 150 supply to prevent boiler condensation. On warmer days the unocc heating curve will be lower than 150. The house will heat to the t-stat setpoint regardless.
A heat loss calc is an average estimation. On the average 25 degree day with overcast sky's and light wind, the estimate will be pretty close and the system will match the temp very closely.
On a calm 25 degree day with lot's of sunshine, the house will overheat.
On a super windy 25 degree night, There will not be enough heat.
If you decide to make the adjustments yourself, just go slow and record everything.
There are settings that will make the system nonfunctional if they are incorrect.
Tekmar has a job record sheet for most products that make the process easier.
@ January 31, 2014 12:00 PM in PlumberFirst thing to check is the arrow on the side and the arrow on the circulator. They should be going in the same direction.
A picture would help.
@ January 31, 2014 11:58 AM in Installing a WaterCop and now I have dripping backflow preventerA problem I have seen with the leak detector is that the water valve gets shut off because of a dripping toilet. The backflow preventer detects lower pressure in the house and allows water to drip out of the boiler loop into the vent. The boiler then depressurizes and locks out. This causes a much bigger problem, the house freezes.
The solution is to put a spring check upstream of the backflow preventer.
I have been curious if this is the sign of a bad devise or if it is normal. Hotrod?
@ January 31, 2014 9:53 AM in tekmar 363 and UNOCCI think there are quite a few settings that should be tweaked.
This woulds be better done by a tech on site that can verify the way your system is setup and piped.
MIX ROOM Unocc 65 Should be set to setback temp ( the temp you want the room during unocc)
BOIL ROOM Unocc 65 same as mix room
DHW TANK UNOCC 80 Why not off
SETPOINT Unocc off
WWSD Unocc 62 this could be set lower (will turn off boiler based on outdoor temp)
MIX ROOM Occ 70 OK
MIX TERM base I thought you had infloor
MIX MIN 150 Seems high, usually more like 90 to110 depending on type
MIX INDR 100 Very high, should be more like 70
MIX DSGN 220 This is incorrect, should be in the 120 to 150 range, depending on type
OUT DSGN 32 should be design temp for your area
MIX MAX off should be set
MOTR SPD 90
10K 2 DHW
BOIL ROOM occ 70
BOIL DSGN 200 This is too high
BOIL MIN 180 This could go as low as 150 depending on needed output (will save energy)
BOIL MASS hevy
DHW THRU valv
DHW TANK occ 180 Way too high
DHW PRI mix
SETPOINT occ 135
WWSD occ off I would turn this on and set to 65
@ January 31, 2014 12:18 AM in tekmar 363 and UNOCCI think your best approach will be to find a way to setback the thermostats when you will be away for long periods. Using the 363 to turn off the DHW will also help, the unocc wwsd setting will also help save energy.
You have a non condensing boiler. There are limits to how far you can safely turn it down.
There are some changes that could be made to your present setting that would help with efficiency. I would want to be a little more familiar with you setup before making suggestions.
@ January 30, 2014 10:56 PM in tekmar 363 and UNOCCWhat type of boiler do you have?
What type of heat?
@ January 30, 2014 9:15 PM in tekmar 363 and UNOCCI think that is a bad idea on most systems.
If you lower the water temps to the point that the room temp is reduced, you will still have a call for heat and the boiler will be maintaining temp the entire time. I would bet that you will actually use more energy set up this way.
This may work for some constant circ systems but is a bad idea for the average residential system.
With TN2 and TN4 the setpoint to the room is lowered and the boiler temps are lowered. This is very different.
@ January 30, 2014 8:00 AM in tekmar 363 and UNOCCThe 363 is not designed to setback room temps.
Those features are available in the TN4 and TN2 models.
@ January 29, 2014 11:46 PM in Closely Spaced Tees - maybe not?Have to disagree with you on this one Steve.
It is just not close.The loops will ghost flow each other.
@ January 29, 2014 12:11 AM in oopsThere are tons of old non barrier systems out there. Replacing the expansion tank and fittings is a must, you just don't want to have all that debris running around in your system. The right thing to do would be to go with a ss circ as well. I have seen some cast circs survive for a long time in 02 environments. with a high temp system the conditions will be worse. I would change the circ as well.
@ January 28, 2014 11:07 PM in New Thermostat 3 Wire Hot Water Boiler SystemIf you slide the lever on the zone valve, you can tell if it is in the open or closed position. If it slides freely with no resistance the valve is open. If you can move it but with significant effort it is closed. You should be able to turn up the t-stat, then check if the valve is opening.
@ January 28, 2014 10:54 PM in Time to Upgrade my ModconGood call on the firetube. How many different temps do you think you will run? On a new system or a complete remodel, you should be able to size your emitters for a single temp. All the firetube boiler will manage one temp well. As you get more complicated the controls may make a difference.
@ January 28, 2014 7:13 PM in Closely Spaced Tees - maybe not?The closely spaced tee's could not be more incorrect. See the attached drawing with credit to Mark Eatherton.
You also should not mount circulators as the one in the picture. It will not last very long in that position.
@ January 27, 2014 11:34 PM in New boiler, Insufficent heatHydro,
Are you thinking that the difference in flow between 0.8 gpm and 1.0gpm is part of the problem with this system? I think not. Both flows should give a delta t of less than 10. The difference would be undetectable.
Nice work Gordy and Harvey downward heat loss to a conditioned space, good call.
@ January 27, 2014 10:26 PM in Does this Graph showHow are the room temps keeping up?
What type of reset controller?
@ January 27, 2014 10:18 PM in rinnai hot water helpYou have been asked quite a few good questions. You really need to do your best to answer them. Are you on natural gas? Has anyone checked the gas pressure in the building? Does the problem go away if you turn off the furnace? Was there ice in the vent?
@ January 27, 2014 10:00 PM in No flow?How are you measuring the delta t?
If you had inadequate flow, you should also see a much wider delta t. Can you get a good measurement at each baseboard?
You are correct that you only need about 2.3 gpm. 1/2" pex with that circ would move that much water.
Air lock? Bad circ? Incorrect piping?
Is the air flow good around the registers.
@ January 27, 2014 6:16 PM in questions to ask for new boiler quote?You definitely won't need another 6x6x6 boiler.
Does the boiler or the blower have a BTU rating?
It sounds like you could replace the boiler and near boiler piping and components without any major redesign.
A high efficiency model would be a good move.
@ January 27, 2014 5:45 PM in questions to ask for new boiler quote?How big is the boiler?
Are the emitters ceiling fan coils?
How many zones? How are they controlled?
Just trying to get a feeling as to how complex your system is.
@ January 27, 2014 5:19 PM in questions to ask for new boiler quote?Who will be designing the new system?
I whole lot has changed in 60 years, a 1 for1 replacement may not be appropriate.
One approach would be to pay someone to design a new system then get apples to apples quotes based on the design.
I think if you ask 10 contractors you will get 10 different bids in both price and scope. This will leave more questions than answers.
At some point you will need to discuss asbestos.
Furnaces heat air, boilers heat water. They are not the same.
If you post pictures, you may get better insight.
@ January 27, 2014 4:57 PM in Gateway + Aerco + Caleffi = nice job.Kevin,
Could you be more specific?
If the circ is moved outside the loop, there is no circulation through the loop when the valve is diverting. This won't work work in a heating loop. Maybe I am misunderstanding your meaning.
Nice looking job. Do you have final pics?