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Zman

Zman

Joined on January 19, 2012

Last Post on July 25, 2014

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Elite FT

@ September 20, 2013 9:44 PM in HTP Elite ???

The elite and elite plus have a Giavonni heat exchanger. It is stainless and a very common exchanger found in many condensing boilers. I. would get the Elite FT. It has the same exchanger that Triangle tube and lochinvar are using.
I like all stainless designs better than aluminum.
Carl

Navien

@ September 20, 2013 11:19 AM in Stick w/ Oil? Convert to Gas? If latter - convert or new boiler? Costs? Thanks for the help!

Homeowner1,

Do you work for Navien?

This question has been asked before with no response.

It sure seems like you are more than a compulsive homeowner and you are essentially posting advertisements for Navien (rule 3).

Carl

Navien

@ September 20, 2013 11:17 AM in Help with using Navien in a primary/secondary loop

Homeowner1,
Do you work for Navien?
This question has been asked before with no response.
It sure seems like you are more than a compulsive homeowner and you are essentially posting advertisements for Navien (rule 3).
Carl

Open???

@ September 20, 2013 8:12 AM in Help with using Navien in a primary/secondary loop

Open radiant is an evil, evil thing.
Open systems become a breading ground for all thing biological, Including legionella.
I have seen systems that are full of slimy organic film that are hooked right to the homes domestic water supply.We are talking about multi million dollar homes. Do not do this. Radiant heat should be a closed system.
If you are really insisting on using a tankless heater as a boiler (another bad plan), put a plate heat exchanger between the 2 systems.
Boilers cost more money because they are designed for the work load.
Carl

Lightning

@ September 20, 2013 7:58 AM in Triangle tube Solo 110 pumps wont shut off

Paul,
I would start by powering down the unit and resetting it. Then I would pull the heat and dhw switch wires to be sure you don't have a smoked switch somewhere else in the system. I would also go through the setup codes and make sure they are at factory defaults.
Chances are, the lightning smoked the controller and you need a new one.
Carl

Glad to here

@ September 19, 2013 9:52 PM in newbie needs help

The circ, expansion tank and the pressure is good.
What is up with the pipes?
Carl

ODR

@ September 19, 2013 2:23 PM in 4 Way Mixing Valve Piping

Mike,
You should do ODR. It will reduce the noise and provide better comfort. What temp are you mixing to now? Most tubing noises stem from rapidly heating the water or improper tubing installation. Continuous circulation will help as will reducing the water temps.
If you lower your boiler temp too much you will have condensation issues. Try to keep your boiler return temps above 140. Depending on your heat loss you could probably run around 130-140 to the floors on the coldest day with your staple up.
Carl

Homeowner1

@ September 19, 2013 12:14 PM in Stick w/ Oil? Convert to Gas? If latter - convert or new boiler? Costs? Thanks for the help!

Whatever Navien is paying you, It is not enough!
Keep up the good work.
I am trying to sell some AC units to Eskimos. I could use your help.
Carl

Condensation

@ September 19, 2013 12:11 PM in 4 Way Mixing Valve Piping

Mike,
 I would be surprised if boiler condensation is much of an issue with a staple up system. They just don't unload the BTU's like a slab.You also have a good amount of buffer water to absorb the cold water that will come in when a zone calls.
Carl

GPM

@ September 19, 2013 10:02 AM in High flow shower heads

I seriously doubt the shower will actually use 17 GPM. It would take a very large domestic water line to deliver that much flow. Installing multiple tankless units would be very expensive and require a new gas meter in most cases.
I would evaluate the actual GPM that the domestic piping can deliver and install a hot water heater with a tank big enough to handle the spike.
I have installed a (theoretical) 6 gpm shower on an 80 gallon electric heater. I warned the owner of the potential problem and prewired for a booster. They have never had a problem. I am positive the owner would have had the booster installed if they had an issue as they paid 6k for the valve without blinking.
Carl

Heatcalc

@ September 19, 2013 12:21 AM in Stick w/ Oil? Convert to Gas? If latter - convert or new boiler? Costs? Thanks for the help!

 Jeff,
To compare the costs of various fuels I like this  www.eia.gov/neic/experts/heatcalc.xls
You just put in your local costs and boiler efficiency. The oversized boiler will reduce your present efficiency.

I don't think you are a good candidate for a conversion burner. Your boiler is just too big.

I am not much of a fan of the amtrol . They have small exchangers and often calcify on the domestic side

The rheem water heater you are looking at is 62% efficient and will have a BTU output of 24,800.

A good properly sized indirect tank will have the same efficiency and output as the boiler.

My personal preference is the triangle tube prestige boiler with a heatflo indirect.
The TT110 looks like a good fit.

One of the rules on this site is "Don't discuss pricing..."

Carl

Minimum Flow?

@ September 18, 2013 11:50 PM in 4 Way Mixing Valve Piping

The only reason for primary/secondary in your case would be if your boiler has a minimum flow requirement. Is it staple up or in slab?
Carl

ROI

@ September 18, 2013 12:00 AM in Should I switch to gas ?

Bill,
It sounds like you have one of those customers that is also obsessed with ROI. The ROI on the boiler conversion is much better with no insulation and cat sized holes.More fuel used = more savings, well sort of. If he did the other improvements first, the number on the boiler would not look as good.
I am starting to learn to give people what they ask for. I mean why not. Who are we to say..
Carl
By the way, I agree with you completely
You were just estimating the cat thing right? I don't love cats, but don't think we should be measuring holes by throwing them around.

As Rich said....

@ September 17, 2013 11:48 PM in Zone actuators & zone valves

You would have an actuator on each loop. That  would be 8 actuators and a big enough transformer to power them all.
You would be better off going with 2 zone valves and 2 regular 4 hole manifolds.
Carl

Backwards

@ September 16, 2013 11:18 PM in newbie needs help

The circulator should be pumping the other way. You should be able to close the green handled gate valves and just flip the circulator over.
I kind of doubt that is causing the pressure to rise that high. I think you have a waterlogged expansion tank. As the temp in the closed system rises the water has no place to expand and the pressure rises.  If you tap on the tank , is it full of water?
Carl

A picture..

@ September 16, 2013 10:34 PM in newbie needs help

Could you post a picture of what you have along with the boiler model?
Is there an expansion tank in your system?
Carl

Instantanious

@ September 16, 2013 5:21 PM in New High Eff Gas Boiler

Instantaneous heaters will never be as efficient as those with a tank. There are so many short cycles from all the small draws of water. Every time someone fills a glass or washes there hands the boiler is short cycling. It is rare that you need 200K/BTU over a long period of time. Keep in mind your typical  electric water heater only produces about 17K/BTU. It can do this for one reason, storage.
A boiler with a tank  will always run long efficient cycles if it is sized and installed correctly.
I have asked both Triangle and Viessman about high turn down ratios. Both companies have deep roots in Europe and are leaders in condensing boiler technology. Both companies say that efficiency drops significantly at high ratios. I mentioned that other companies are claiming 20 to 1. They just smiled and asked if they have DOE tests to support the efficiency at those ratios.
I have no idea where homeowner one lives, ground temps do not vary much between summer and winter. Maybe 10 degrees? I can't follow the thinking where the delta t in the Summer is 1/2 what it is in the Winter.
Carl

Application

@ September 16, 2013 3:14 PM in New High Eff Gas Boiler

I am personally a big fan of the firetube heat exchanger that triangle tube introduced and is now being offered by lochinvar and others.I share your concern about aluminum. The problem seems to be worse with certain water conditions.
There are some applications where the combi units make sense. The issue with instantaneous combi boilers is that once you size the boiler for your Domestic water needs, you are extremely oversized for your heating load. This is bad for efficiency and maintenance.
The triangle tube prestige excellence combi and the new viessman combi have internal tanks which require less BTU's for domestic water.
I would find a company that is willing to do a heat loss calc on your home and evaluate you domestic water needs to get you the right product. Sizing and installation are very important.
Carl

HR

@ September 16, 2013 10:37 AM in Taco ZVC404-EXP Problems

Mark,
Did you see Hot Rod's note on your other post. If you don't have resistors on the zone valves you will keep burning out end switches. He is the Calliffi trainer.
I would also evaluate whether you need the end switches at all.
Carl

Interesting product

@ September 14, 2013 7:26 PM in Frozen heating pipes

John,
How does your product deal with irregular conditions and odd joist spacings? Any idea of the pricepoint?
In my climate I would never consider putting water pipes in any exterior wall or attic, period.
The new fire sprinkler codes are going to tempt people to put pipes in some bad places. Don't even get me started on the use of domestic water for fire suppression. Can you say legionella outbreak?
Carl

Pex

@ September 14, 2013 7:11 PM in Radiant Heat not Heating

 I had not realized the Wirsbo Multicor was pex b. I guess they need to do it that way to laminate it.
The pex a ,b and c are not grades. It is the process used to make it. I am not saying all pex b products are bad. I just have great faith in pex a and wirsbo.
This expains the process.
http://www.uponorpro.com/~/media/Extranet/Files/CDAM/CDAM_Manual_7thEd_0711_Ch3.aspx

Carl

I Like it..

@ September 13, 2013 6:40 PM in steam heat, disable 1st floor and leave 2nd floor

Great idea. make sure to leave an inoperable T-stat in front of the sensor so they can crank up the heat when they feel cold.
Carl
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