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Robert_H

Robert_H

Joined on May 31, 2013

Last Post on March 25, 2014

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IceSailor

@ March 25, 2014 4:00 PM in Diverter Tee ID

Thanks for your very informative reply! As far as the boiler goes it does have a tank-less and it is piped but he uses a separate tank-less water heater. So the one on the boiler  is isolated. 




Does your handle, "Icesailor" have to do with previous career?

Boiler

@ March 25, 2014 2:59 PM in Diverter Tee ID

The boiler is a Williamson OWT-3 series 1 Oil burner
IBR rating BTUH = 78,000

Low Boiler Temp

@ March 25, 2014 1:38 PM in Diverter Tee ID

We were making a sketch of the system this weekend and the system go a call for heat. I noticed that the boiler gauge never got above 155F.  Pressure was 20 PSI.
This seems bad to me, if the boiler is at 155, how low is the return temp... 
The last radiator in this system barely get warm which leads me to believe the return temp is probably low. 

Could the capped off Diverter Tee cause this much of a problem?
 

No zone valves in my life so far

@ March 25, 2014 1:11 PM in Cast Iron to Pex Zone and Pump and Meter question

No experience, so I cant comment on the zone valves or controls. You existing pump seems like overkill to me me but your calculations should get you the truth on that.

Do the math before you buy

@ March 24, 2014 10:27 AM in Cast Iron to Pex Zone and Pump and Meter question

Before you pull the trigger on the Bumble Bee make sure you know what it is going to do for you. I’m saying this because we are both small system owners with big easy flowing radiators (as in low head loss). Your smallest pipe is ¾” so you are even lower head than I am. The nice ECM, Variable Speed Pumps are designed to cover a wide range and we are at the low end of it.   Look at the bumble bee curve, there is an envelope for the Delta T mode, if you fall below that envelope you will just ride the low speed curve as if it was a fixed speed pump. You should calculate your system head and flow rate and plot it on the pump curve. (the links I provided earlier should help) When I did, I found that my system would only be in the Delta –T envelope on design day.  I would still be getting the benefit of a ECM circulator but I wanted to take advantage Delta pumping. I had already purchased the Bumble Bee and fortunately was able to return it once I showed the problem to the distributor.  The Taco rep even confirmed my conclusions.  I WAS disappointed that I couldn’t use a Delta T circulator but I am very satisfied with the B&G ecocirc Auto (Delta-P) that I chose.  

You should do the math and make an informed decision.

Diagram

@ March 22, 2014 4:10 PM in Cast Iron to Pex Zone and Pump and Meter question

at this point people might be able to give you better feedback if you post a diagram of what you plan to do.
R

Icesailor

@ March 21, 2014 6:39 PM in Diverter Tee ID

yes, there is one capped Tee. Its not were a rad was removed, it is on the last rad in the loop and apparently it was not getting hot enough so someone capped the thrush tee and put a newer B&G Tee in the middle of the system to bring warmer water over to this rad. so in this case to fix it, we will remove the old Tee to remove the restriction. (or remove the new tee and restore the original...)

There is also some odd staggering of of mono flows that don't look like any arrangement I have read about. right now we are sketching the system so we can make sense of it.

There are some of the standard problems I have learned about here: relatively new, way over-sized cast iron boiler boiler and not pumping away.

It looks like it was originally a nice old school mono-flow system that was added too, to put heat into a remodeled basement and put heat to the second floor which originally did not have heat. So now some of the rads don't get very warm unless you drain the cold water out via the vent ;) There is a mix of the original rads, CA baseboard and fin tube baseboard

it belongs a young man who works for me, has a few kids and is on a tight budget. right now I just want to help him figure out the "must dos" and then a longer term plan as funds come available. I think the must dos are to get that lone monoflo tee out of the picture and get the circulator "pumping away"

Thanks for replying

Went back and got a picture

@ March 21, 2014 1:37 PM in Diverter Tee ID

Should have took one to start with

Diverter Tee ID

@ March 20, 2014 11:37 AM in Diverter Tee ID

I'm looking a a diverter tee system that looks to have been modified a few times and is a bit hacked.   the Tees with rings are easy to sort out but some have arrows and the "supply tee" on one side and "Thrush" on the other.  There is nothing at Thrushes website about these.  It seems like the because it says "Supply Tee" the the Tee should be on the inlet side of the radiator and the arrows point with the flow.
Do I have this right?

"I actually do have someone coming over to look at it later today."

@ March 13, 2014 2:23 PM in Mono Flow Issues

Im curious what were the results of the inspection?

HD-2 question?

@ March 12, 2014 12:49 PM in Anyone familiar with "Heat Load Pro" software?

John, I tried the HD-2 demo and was disappointed that it the only radiation types were baseboard and radiant floor. I couldn't work around it either, like I couldn't modify a baseboard section  to simulate a radiator. etc.  I wonder if that is just a limitation of the demo. In the full version are other radiant emitters available?
Thanks
Robert

Beautiful

@ March 7, 2014 12:53 PM in Recently Completed Radiant Job

I love the boiler space layout.

I checked, not in junk or trash

@ March 3, 2014 7:10 PM in Hot Rod

I found an email address for you and forwarded the original to you.
Thanks
Robert

Hot Rod (personal)

@ March 3, 2014 2:23 PM in Hot Rod

I sent you a message via the "contact use" feature of the forum recently.  I just want to make sure it got through to you.
thanks
Robert

I cant see the picture

@ March 3, 2014 8:53 AM in BTU Radiator Output? (see attached photo)

But here are two resources for determining radiator output.

http://www.columbiaheatingsupply.com/page_images/Sizing%20Cast%20Iron%20Radiator%20Heating%20Capacity%20Guide.pdf

http://nepacrossroads.com/about3401.html#p27381

there are many more resources available. Google "cast iron radiator output". using the dimensions of your radiator, you should be able to get close.

Not realy,

@ March 1, 2014 3:20 PM in Cast Iron to Pex Zone and Pump and Meter question

one on each manifold would only control the flow to that manifold and not allow you to balance the flow to each load which allows you to compensate for different pipe length (head loss).
with the large pipe size you have and low head loss in your distribution you may not have to worry too much about balancing. If It were me and I was on a tight budget I would try it without balancing valves you can always add them later. You might find that you don't need it at all or only on one zone say that has a rad or two on really different lengths.

Caleffi 132 series quick setter

@ March 1, 2014 1:21 PM in Cast Iron to Pex Zone and Pump and Meter question

I have one, it reads 2-8 gpm (3/4 in), well made and works great. If you put one on each zone that wouldn't be too costly. You shouldn't need to more than 8 GPM in you loops It depends on how the rads are piped in each zone. However, if you want to put one on each rad return, that could add up a bit.

http://www.caleffi.us/caleffi/en_US/Site/Products/Product_news/args/detail/~Details~News~news_detail_0000908/type/newshome/index.sdo

I must say

@ February 28, 2014 9:35 PM in Got my Sorbox today.

that is some nice looking equipment!

"My apologies if I came across arrogantly. "

@ February 27, 2014 4:57 PM in Cast Iron to Pex Zone and Pump and Meter question

You did not come across like that to me, at all.
Just a guy asking for help.

First off YeDIYer

@ February 27, 2014 3:59 PM in Cast Iron to Pex Zone and Pump and Meter question

 I am not a professional here. Just a home owner with a passion for this stuff. I  designed my system, with a lot of help, and I installed it. I keep a log book and record readings on my system every day to help me with fine tuning it.  It’s my baby, warts and all, So take what I say with the appropriate grains of salt.

I’m curious, Where do you live and What boiler do you have?

What your local plumbers are saying makes sense but so far I have not heard or read any remarks about TRV performance in variable environments. We have a had a pretty variable year here in CT and with ODR/ TRVs and a variable speed pump, I’m happy!  I'm curious so I'm going to dig on that a little.  Let’s see what the pros come back with.

I will say this about pump sizing, you need to know the flow requirements and the worst case head loss the pump will see. To determine flow you need to do a heat loss estimate on your house if you haven't done so.   

Simple app that a lot of people use.
http://www.slantfin.com/homeowners-page/ipadapp.html

Search this forum for “heat loss” and there are several other recommendations. But I will say this, I spent a month on my heat loss, building a spreadsheet with all the various construction components because none of the available programs covered all the Hodge podge construction methods in my house.  In the end my Heat Loss Calc was 42100. The simple applications were giving me something like 44000. Lesson learned, keep it simple!

Taco has several good basic hydronic courses available including heat loss calculations and circulator selection available at:
http://flopro.taco-hvac.com/flopro_u.html#

Also, Caleffi has some great learning resources at:
 http://www.caleffi.us/caleffi/en_US/Site/Technical_library/Idraulica_magazine/index.sdo

Good luck!

another option

@ February 27, 2014 9:58 AM in Cast Iron to Pex Zone and Pump and Meter question

Is to drop the zone valves and use TRVs on on your radiators, if you have room to add them.  The TRVs with the variable speed pump work very nice together. I agree with Rich, with the low head loss of your system and depending on your load, you might be able to get by with one circulator like a TACO Bumble Bee. And with the TRVs you have eliminated the three electrical circuits for the zone valves.
I put a system like this in my house this year and could not be happier, it is simple and effective. I had my eye on using a Delta-T circ but because of how small my system is I could not use Bumble Bee. The B&G ecocirc Auto (Delta-P) was the only Variable that could go low enough for my low flow and head. 

*

@ February 19, 2014 8:46 AM in Steam/Water heat service in Providence RI area

Ill do that Tim.
Thanks You
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