Heating Help

if you trust Scientific American

@ April 15, 2011 6:47 PM in softened water in boilers

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=how-do-water-softeners-wo


basically the sodium ions go to the shower head.

maybe not clear

@ April 13, 2011 4:00 PM in No April Fools here...

ME,

i was talking about using a window as a PV source as being highly inefficient or you could say very expensive.   my reason is that the PV/window, i assume that is vertical, will get little peak power seasonal.   thus a PV panel on the roof would get much more energy output yearly.   i find a vertical panel is good for about 3 months a year.
you would get no power in the summer.

with the high cost of PV's you want to harvest as much as possible, generally that s not putting them in a vertical position, and then forget it if you have overhangs.

i looked at the raven site, little disappointed that i could not clearly read their graphs.  I will look again, but first impression was not that impressive, sciences wise.   when I see free heat/cooling 100% efficient, i start wondering...........

from my experience, the best way to solve solar over heating is using air flow.  your north side would most likely require more heat than the south floor could deliver.  the sun seems to spread heat pretty evenly in a room, so if you drop the floor temp 5F, it probably won't get noticed in time.  

interesting ideas none the less.

in my case pv/batteries were much cheaper than 1 mile of power company line.
you do live life far differently than your city counter parts.

Nice stuff!

@ April 13, 2011 2:32 PM in you are using incorrect slab loss numbers

lot a data in those pictures, after I study them for a couple of hours!

bioler pro

@ April 13, 2011 11:33 AM in Are boilers next?

if GM could built a 3/4 ton truck that got 40mpg, why wouldn't they?   they would out sell all  other truck manufacturers in the WORLD and  could afford to buy an oil company.

try loading up a prius with all your tool and euipment/supplies and report back on it's performance.  you might need to pull a 2 ton trailer, but shouldn't still get 40mpg?

how can a manufacturer be subject to poor installations?

who buys a

@ April 12, 2011 5:15 PM in Are boilers next?

78% eff FHA unit anymore?  I admit there probably is a small minority, but seems most people go in the other direction.  

i would like to see ECM motors on the frig though.

whats your plan?

@ April 12, 2011 1:01 PM in Give me your best ideas

how much "back-up" do you think you need?   WE are from all parts of the country so we can't 'see' what your need is??

what percentage do you think the solar can handle?

if its major,  gas/oil  makes sense, if its minor, electric makes sense.  certainly solar could handle the whole thing, depending on available sun .  all depends on size.

PV windows

@ April 12, 2011 12:19 PM in No April Fools here...

not a bad idea.   but that would be pretty expensive way of doing it?

your highest output would only happen during the narrow winter months with sun angle,  I can see this working in an office building, but with a residence, you'd be way ahead putting standard PV 'son the roof.  thus window PV's would be real inefficient, but a great talking piece.

how would you bank this ? batteries?

Not Bad ME......

@ April 12, 2011 10:37 AM in No April Fools here...

will you use a heat pump to move the lower temp water around?

I found an old file on my laptop from the wall,  60 ways to eliminate solar gain, I thought that was funny, sounded like trying to eliminate infiltration......or something bad.

you would need cool water to remove heat from the room getting too much sun. wheres this cool water going to come from?

dump load

@ April 11, 2011 2:13 PM in Give me your best ideas

How many gallons a minute will be your worst case that has to be met?  Oh, and total gallons needed in any worst case time period.

I would guess if you need no space heating you have a large available amount of solar ? 

maybe 5 ft down on perimeter insulation?

@ April 8, 2011 1:23 PM in Getting the wild ones this year

I might think about 5 ft down, heavily insulated, turning it into more of an isolated environment.  and maybe not even bother with insulating the 'tub' bottom.

what is the desired root temperature?

 

correctly sized unit

@ April 8, 2011 12:03 PM in Can electric WH power my Radiant system

at the coldest day of the year?  most say  it should run 100% of the time.

I would prefer to see it running at 90%.   giving  it a chance to keep up in  a bad winter storm with 50mph winds and 15 degrees below average coldest temperatures.

quick test

@ April 8, 2011 10:49 AM in "Pool Noodle" as pipe insulation

get a piece of standard pipe insulation, and a pool noodle, see if there is any difference in how quick or easy they burn.   my guess is they both give off tasty fumes when burned.     don't forget too, if your pipe insulation is burning, what other stuff is already burning too........

also you can check the on the box of pipe insulation and see if there is any "approvals".

The Chicken OR the Egg ?

@ April 8, 2011 10:33 AM in you are using incorrect slab loss numbers

sounds like the which came first, chicken or the egg debate.

on one hand, you need to know the temperature at the bottom(supply temp) of the slab to understand your true losses.

on the other hand, you need to know the slab loss and the structure loss to determine what the supply needs to be to
satify the structure.

as far as perimeter insulation, at least, it should be treated as a 'wall' and use the minimum code R value for walls.

on the other hand, a better approach is use the same BTU loss as required by the walls, but use the true slab temp
which is higher than the 70F used for inside temp.   therefore the R value will be higher than required for the walls.

so, if you keep using 70F to determine your losses, well, you'll be lost.

ah come on ME, where's the boiler box?

@ April 7, 2011 6:02 PM in No April Fools here...

where's the thinking out of the box here?

you come to a house thats too warm from passive FREE  heat;   no pumps,valves,ODR's, antifreezes, boilers and you don't see a great start for a heating system?   Isn't over heating an easier problem than under heating efficiency wise?

I agree passive heating isn't a perfect heating system, but how can you really get simpler, more cost effective system?  they don't have to be caves with only southern windows, unless you fear to come out of the box :)

I understand the heat wells, but is it really practical for the small guy?

wouldn't a spring snow melt kind of wash away the heat?

flux sensors

@ April 4, 2011 4:30 PM in you are using incorrect slab loss numbers

I see those are pretty small devices.    so, do you do 20 experiments on 20 different  locations on the wall and do an average?

what is the expected error.   remember to, those heatloss equations are simpler forms of pretty complicated stuff.   did you ever read up on "significant figures" as i suggested long ago?  that will help you understand error in measurements.  fancy tool can give you fancy errors.

yah, I guess i'm pretty foolish

@ April 4, 2011 4:22 PM in No April Fools here...

hey Sal, I consider my place to be passive solar, though not by design, I just like windows.

guess the other day when it was 35F outside and 70F inside that was all bunk.  at midnight when is was 16F outside it was still too warm inside to start a fire....

you are right ME, simple solutions are often bad ideas........  we could talk for months about simple solutions ignored for more complex costly ones. 

thats one of my favorite comment, "yah I saw one of those once, it didn't work, therefore none of those systems work"

100 ft of insulation

@ April 2, 2011 3:59 PM in heat day one

even with 100ft of insulation the heat would still migrate though the material.

our plant could be considered perfectly insulated since its surrounded by vacuum thousands of miles thick.   but if we were perfectly insulated the sun would continue to heat the earth til it was the same temp as the sun.

my question is: what happens if you take away ALL heat, is there a point were electrons fall from the atom like apples out of a tree?

why not just

@ April 2, 2011 2:02 PM in No April Fools here...

build super insulated, passive solar buildings...............

I'd wager to say storage is the problem with ALL alternative energies, being solar/wind.

I leave out biofuels.

seems the bore systems have a chance of ground contamination?

why not?

@ April 2, 2011 10:35 AM in end of the week ?

nuclear powered pace makers were once common.  in perspective, a suitcase would be huge!

So if a person wants efficiency, what do you

@ April 1, 2011 6:49 PM in you are using incorrect slab loss numbers

recommend?

if they are building with 6-8in walls, want an efficient system, and ask you to recommend perimeter insulation amounts, what do you say?  R10?

I have read lots of posts on cold radiant slabs.........................

I agree infiltration can be a big problem. 

cart before the horse

@ April 1, 2011 6:38 PM in Can electric WH power my Radiant system

you need to determine what the heatloss of the house is going to be, then decide if you can afford the electricity to heat it!

 you can also do it backwards, decide how much money you want to spend on electricity and determine how much the insulation will cost.

there's electric induction heaters out there that can melt a ton of steel in less than a minute, but it all cost money!

I would build it super insulated so you can use electric to heat, don't forget passive solar too.  yesterday I got free heat all day long, didn't need to light the woodstove til 2am. I live north of 47 degrees lat.

air cooling/ air temps

@ April 1, 2011 11:04 AM in you are using incorrect slab loss numbers

but did you understand my possible point?

couldn't the ridge vent temp be low with low air flow = low btu loss

then, vent temp low, higher air low = higher btu loss?

suggesting that heatloss is being masked by increase air flow through the vent?

thats what its suppose to do anyway.

you post suggested that maybe 3 1/2 inches of insulation is sufficient based on IR view of roof? 

just wondering.........

added: is that a steel roof or shingle?